yet be cast opposite Waris ‘the S is for sexayyy’ Ahluwalia

ah, crow crap. you got there before i did. hehehhe......ah, yes. the reason i got life aquatic. whoops. now, i pray he can teach miss clemente next to him to cover up a bit. (guessing salwar kameezes are out of the question).

this reminds me, friends of ours were having a little discusion on him, trying to imagine who he'd be a great pair with - we thought of kiran ahluwalia, christina ricci, lucy liu, and bjork. one of tose 20 questions kinds of deals.

ah, but yes.......makes me reiterate - we need more sardars filling up the entertainment industry. aside from the obvious umm....physical improvements they bring to the screen, they respresent values sorely needed. and i 'm bored to death of the same old cliches, so let's get some sardars in good numbers, being credited with dignity for the wonderful conrtibutions to our community. and of course, equal female equivalents.

Manish .. you make me happy with the sardar posts =)

Does it say anywhere what his role in the movie is? Or did I just miss that in the links?

He's apparently playing a bank clerk.

Manish .. you make me happy with the sardar posts =)

ditto need more!

:)

In Layer Cake, a British Sikh actor had a small role as a crooked accountant. I love how in British films, desis just wander around, unremarked upon.

I love how in British films, desis just wander around, unremarked upon.

Until they come under the SM scanner. ;)

Didnt realise that Spike Lee was a Gunner. Thanks

My turn to rant:

Does anyone remember that Spike Lee film in which Edward Norton starred? I think it was 24th hour or something along that lines - the name is escaping me - it's too early right now.

Although the movie wasn't half bad, I had issues with Edward Norton's characters' rant at the beginning of the movie. In it, he rants about every ethnic group imaginable, but NO, he doesn't start with a more visible/known ethnic group such as african americans, or latinos or the irish, he starts with - DING DING DING - yours truly - us "underground" desis. Furthermore his character equates various desi groups with terrorists and every other horribly wrong/mistaken stereotype imaginable. Okay, now in his defense, the character was pissed off and went off illogically about a lot of ethnic groups. But my issue with it was that desis were the FIRST, so the audience did not have any idea that the character was off his rocker and the ideas he were presenting were clearly wrong; i.e. If he had started with a more visible ethnic group (x), the audience would be shocked since they know that it's not p.c. to say such and such about x group. How do I know the audience felt what Edward Norton's character was true/acceptable? Well, I heard several cackles from the audience - especially from this girl directly behind me - when Norton starts on and on about stinkin' like curry. The audience felt, since it was first, that it was all legitimate. They totatlly didn't get that it was a rant until half way through the rant, and I'm sure most dumbasses didn't go back and reasseess that the first comment about desis was part of the rant. Aaargh!

Anyways, I turned around and told the dumbass girl to shut up. And she looked bewildered and did. Very uncharacteristic of me, but some people just think "it's all in good fun" until they realize there are real people out there, affected by this ignorant shit. Caricatures and stereotypes remove us from viewing people as human.

That's my rant, Spike Lee! That's my rant! End.

Damn

Spike Lee is wearing an Arsenal Football Club shirt.

Ang

Spike Lee was criticised about his depiction of Jewish characters in one of his movies about a jazz musician once.

aww, he took his naked kuri and his mom to premiere ... how shweet.

Ang, you mean this rant?

Fuck the Sikhs and the Pakistanis bombing down the avenues in decrepit cabs, curry steaming out their pores, stinking up my day. Terrorists in fucking training. SLOW THE FUCK DOWN! ...

Fuck Osama Bin Laden, Al Qaeda, and backward-ass, cave-dwelling, fundamentalist assholes everywhere... You towel headed camel jockeys can kiss my royal Irish ass!

Yeah, that's the one, Manish.

Now, picture the dialogue with images of innocent desis going about their day. That's how a racist thinks. It was a bad idea to start off with that ethnic group. I totally understand the meaning of the rant, but Spike Lee showed irresponsibility and ignorance of our issues in using a misunderstood and not as visible ethnic group first. Ontop of this, the accusations of being terrorists is a pretty serious one. Maybe the sequencing was totally innocent, or perhaps, along the lines of the Simpsons creators, he knew it would start the rant off with humour (towelheads! HILARIOUS, right?). Whatever his motive, it was pure ignorance. You should have heard the cackling in the audience. And sometimes there is no Ang to physically, err, I mean verbally correct the reactions of the viewers.

I hope the handsome Ahluwalia has taught him a thing or two. I expect more from a person of colour. Why can't we extrapolate our own racist experiences, and just show a little empathy for other minority groups??? Why does it have to be everybody for oneself???

"This year after Carnival,

I am heading to the North

Guess where? Up in Germany,

that's where I'm going to be

Ah just have the feeling that we should be spreading this creole bacchanal..."

In this case, the entire rant takes on a wide range of New York ethnicities. Whereas in Glengarry Glen Ross, it was focused on Patels.

ooh, some good material here.

lord kitchener -- yeah, i saw that too. in the trini express. great stuff! this world cup is going to be extra fruity. i've got tix for the ivory coast's first-round games.

ang -- i'm going to defend spike here. if you consider the rant in "25th hour" from the beginning, he starts off clearly with "fuck this city and everyone in it." that's the statement of intent. then the listing begins. and he's looking in a mirror and eventually telling himself to fuck himself. it's a great scene and well executed in the film.

when you play with racial stereotypes, even if it's smart play, there will always be idiots who read it superficially, like the girl sitting next to you in the theatre. don't let it get to you. just because playing with race is tricky doesn't make it less important and ultimately valuable.

also, the scene is a self-referential echo of the fantastic traded ethnic insult sequence in "Do the Right Thing."

finally, the screenwriter for "25th hour" was the author of the original novel, david benioff; so if you still don't like the scene, don't pin it just on spike...

peace

I hear you siddhartha, and I understand the rant and it's importance completely, I just don't like the sequence of it. And yes, despite the "f the city" line first (which is generally-directed), the first SPECIFIC ethnic group mentioned are sikhs and pakistanis - being a misunderstood group, there were alot of cackles coming from the audience. I'm glad I got to see it in the theatre, or I may have overlooked the importance of the sequence and it's impact. I wouldn't have a problem with even the terrorist part, if it was placed maybe later, after the rant on puerto ricans. Do you see my point? By then, the audience would realize this character is in the nuthouse, and everything he is saying is ignorant and based on anger.

Plus, even if the screenplay is based on a book, I wouldn't take that book and make it 100% true to form - the author could have overlooked a point - as in this rant. For example, I like the show, Welcome Back Kotter, but if I had a chance to do a modern day version, I would definitely include a few female sweathogs, b/c I know better, and wouldn't feel the pressure to stay 100% true to it's original form. I would take my artistic merit and ability to interpret the world and "do the right thing".

aww, he took his naked kuri and his mom to premiere ... how shweet.

;) and some key fashion accesorries - safety pins and a hairbrush. if i were standing there, i'd also look A LOT happier than that. ;) mm......must be paying attention to the camera and not that fine creation with him.

waris dear, please leave the lass with the brillo bouffant at the door with leonardo! oohh...plleaaasssee! please, please, please!

not that fine creation with him

ok, before soemone ribs me, i just noticed my typo. fine creation with HER. she should realise the fine creation with her. ah, havn't had my coffee yet.

To be fair - when you read the rant in full - every ethnicity including African Americans gets cursed by the racist character. How else do you depict the rotten mind of a racist, or a man who is falling apart and full of seething hatred? Every single stereotype there is pretty damn nasty and racist, and you cant hold Spike Lee to account for the tittering of idiots in the cinema. If it was the Koreans first, or the Hassidic Jews, or whatever.

Every single stereotype there is pretty damn nasty and racist, and you cant hold Spike Lee to account for the tittering of idiots in the cinema. If it was the Koreans first, or the Hassidic Jews, or whatever.

Let me clarify that nobody laughed at any other stereotype, because you're not allowed to laugh at any other stereotype (see Manish's point #5). For the last time, I understand the rant completely, and unfortunately, I also got some unwanted insight into the mindset of the typical non-visible-minority audience member. I am well aware that he included african americans in his rant - perhaps if he had included them first, every audience member , regardless of colour and creed, would get it because they know that Spike Lee is african american, they know he can't possibly be agreeing with what is said, AND that is just not pc. Making fun of desis is sadly, acceptable.

For the last time, I understand the rant and it's importance, and I still don't agree with the sequencing of it. I think I made a valid point above for a better sequence. The audience members took the first ethnic group (grossly misunderstood, underrepresented group) to be the truth. If it was placed later, the same audience members may have sub-conciously thought, "these stereotypes are dead wrong". I don't know how else I can convey the weight of that point.

I don't think Spike is racist, it's just something he overlooked, and hopefully nothing along the lines of the intentions of the Simpsons creators.

Finally, yes, it certainly isn't as offensive as the Glengarry case (especially Manish's points 2 and 5). The only reason I bring it up at all is that the entire experience impacted me and made me think about artistic expression and responsibility, and that this particular post has a Sikh actor alongside Spike Lee, which obviously triggered my memory.

That's my 2 cents. You can agree or disagree or not worry about it all. But I think what I had to say is valid, even if it isn't the most burning issue out there - which I am not suggesting it is.

ok, i took a look at the original rant (pp. 111-113 of the paperback edition). it's longer, fuller, richer, more complete, and even funnier. the cab drivers still get pride of place. however the terrorist bit there, and the longer osama bit at the end, are additions (the book came out in 2000).

so, after performing this exegesis...

i'll agree with you ang, on your point about the terrorist connotation. whether it was spike's or benioff's doing or both, it's clumsy and regrettable, though i won't make it a capital offense.

i won't agree with you on the placement point, though. so the desi cab drivers went first. big deal. hell, if you fly into la guardia chances are your first dealings will be with a desi cabdriver. it's only right!

peace

The 'Every ethnic group gerts trashed' is such a underdeveloped opinion. Even if in the last line he tells himself to fuck off cuz he had it all and threw it away.

This entire film seemed more like a tribute to NYC's white ethnics rather than a love letter to NYC. The burden of 9/11 falled unevenly on them, apparently. Monty might be a drugdealer but viewers remember...he's a dealer with a heart of gold. He's saving a puppy in the first scene for God's sake. Lee as usual is heavy handed and schlocky. But visually the film is lovely.