What about the Varanasi bombings, then? I think the media still want to hold Gujarat riots as a ransom/reason for all the terrorist activities and that is plainly aboninable.

When people tell me that Mumbai has got this high spirit and getting over the 200 killings in matter of hours and India got over another 200 (Varanasi) killings within months and also ever increasing count in Kashmir, I want to tell the media to actually 'get-over-gujuarat-riots' too.

That's very excellent reasoning actually. But I believe we should refrain from listening to anyone but the government. After all, look at the source. If this was so, you'd think Indian Intelligence would have figured it out first.

After 9/11 I remember reading/hearing conspiracy theory crap from people who claimed that it might have been the US government who planned it for reasons I can't remember. And all of their reasoning was as strong as this Gujrat-7/11 connection.

Don't worry about it, India seems to have made it through this one without any post-incident violence.

That's very excellent reasoning actually. But I believe we should refrain from listening to anyone but the government. After all, look at the source.

I agree. I tried to make sure to separate fact from rumor as best I could.

Indeed very thoughtful analysis. I hope India come out strong after these senseless acts of in humanity.

To get an idea of what the terrorists targetted - they wanted white-collar targets. I guess even the terrorists knew that poor man's life in India of much lessor worth.

If they wanted to kill Gujaratis, there is a whole state full of them. They did this to gain the most publicity and propoganda with minimal effort. Bombay has better access to news networks, trains run far more frequently, and there are way too many targets of opportunity. Want to sell it to a population in an attempt to co-opt their loyalties to 'the cause', make sure a few Gujus (IF THE ABOVE LOGIC IS VALIDATED) go along with it. It'll be far easier to 'justify'.

ToI is a moronic paper. I'm sure the terrorists were more than happy to get a large number of Gujarati casualties but the article implies that targeting Gujaratis was their SOLE purpose - HIGHLY unlikely given the 2005 Delhi blasts, 2005 Ayodhya blasts and this year's Varanasi blasts, none of which targeted Gujaratis in particular.

They did this to gain the most publicity and propoganda with minimal effort. Bombay has better access to news networks

Gujudude,

I know as much as you or anyone else reading MSM for last two days. IMO Mumbai was a target for the same reason NYC was: It is the financial hub and houses the stock-exchange. Why first class coaches?: You send fear amongst the stock-brokers, bankers, programmers, etc.

MNCs might get nervous coming to India.

A cosmopolitan town like Mumbai gives you the anonymity (to the terrorists) that might not be possible in lot of places in India.

The list of people dead are from all regions, religions, and caste. Mahim has a very strong Christian population. Most (or all) casualities are men as they are separate coaches for women.

Kush:

I know as much as you or anyone else reading MSM for last two days. IMO Mumbai was a target for the same reason NYC was: It is the financial hub and houses the stock-exchange. Why first class coaches?: You send fear amongst the stock-brokers, bankers, programmers, etc.

I don't disagree. It all plays into same effect. The stock markets showed resiliency by gaining (if I read that right), but I would add what you said to what I wrote above. My statement was definitely not comprehensive. People care what happens to Mumbai, hence it draws more attention. There is more value in disruption of the finanical hub. Said disruption would show populations how effective [whatever terrorist group] is at bringing THE city to a halt. Just like people care what happened to NYC and Washington DC (the later often overlooked in all 9-11 discussions). Fortunately, citizens of all these cosmopolitan cities are far more tough than these criminals assume despite the losses of their fellow comrades.

Abhi:

The use of RDX, timer devices and trains are common to both incidents

That may not mean anything, because according to our resident explosive expert, GujuDude at #6, RDX is very common and easily available on the black market even though it is not manufactured in India.

Still the connection to Let is being made.
Use of RDX hints at LeT hand in Mumbai blasts - The Hindu

But I believe we should refrain from listening to anyone but the government.

The Lashkar-e-Taiba, intelligence reports suggest, has recruited local youths saying that they should take revenge for the atrocities heaped on the minority community in Gujarat where the Narendra Modi government is heavily funded by the rich Gujarati businessmen of Mumbai.

Um, how does all of this mean "nothing". All I said was that terrorist bomb setups aren't high tech, thats all. They can be, but usually aren't. The involvement of RDX does not signify how sophisticated the setup is. RDX is a popular plastic explosive with these guys. I backed it up with sources that state these explosives have been around for many many years. RDX was also used in the 1993 Bombay terrorist attacks.

By the way, I actually do work with military explosives, but I don't claim to be any 'expert'.

I don't know where you're going with this. Can you explain yourself or your logic of what you're trying to say better?

I wouldn't rely to much on TOI either, many of the casualties have not been identified yet, thus impossible deem majority og the dead as gujaratis. The reason why the bombs were placed in the first class compartments was simply because they ae easier to get into as they are not as jammed packed during rush hour as the second or economy class.

This goes beyond reacting to Gujarat riots and Kashmir, LeT has many times earlier stated that their aim is to destroy the Indian State, "liberating" Kashmir is only a small part of the deal. These people are fanatics, one of the other groups named, Jaish e Mohammad is the same group that killed US journalist Daniel Pearl in Pakistan a couple of years ago and this info comes from the U.S govt.

When it comes to the issue to Modi and Gujarat there is nothing the Central govt or anyone else can do, the guy was elected with a large majority and has some more time to go before the next set of elections. Mumbai is a much more mature city than used to be 13 years ago and that period of time was highly charged as the Ayodhya demolition was fresh in the minds of the people and we weren't the economic power we are now, priorities and mindsets are quite different. Also, the Shiv Sena has kept quiet so far and is not in power in Mumbai. All these factors contribute to the absence of any communal reactions this time.

All, please browse over the following news article (short) published on August 15, 2005 and see the preciseness of redictions/warnings made in it:

Surat to pip Mumbai as new terror hotspot

since Mumbai is within striking distance of Surat, the police are a worried lot. They say the gangsters could mount hit-and-run strikes on Mumbai from Surat

According to sources, Pakistan's ISI may be looking at Dawood to have access to the atomic plant at Tarapore as it is close to Surat.

Gujarat is not unfamiliar terrain for Dawood's men. Most of the arms meant for D-Company are shipped in through Gujarat's porous borders. The consignment mostly Pakistani and Chinese manufactured firearms is smuggled across the state by stashing it in specially-created cavities in cars.

Sometimes the simplist explanation may be the best one. Have any off you ever ridden on a Mumbai commuter, much less during rush hour? First class itself is jampacked, it is hard enough to move around there as it is with explosives. It could just be that fist class coaches were selected because they are the least congested and would arouse least suspicion if there was a lot of movement (considering there is no room for such in other cars)

I think this is a case of where Gujaratis *seemed* targeted, but it's only because they are disproportionately represented amongs certain sectors of Bombay society (diamond traders, stockbrokers, businessmen and professionals in general). Bombay is like, what, 30-40% Gujarati? In many areas you can't spit without hitting one, right? Anyways, bomb blasts also hit Borivali and Jogeshwari, areas with large Muslim populations. Khar, Mahim, and Matunga are pretty diverse, I think. The only "Guju Ghettos" I know of in Bombay are in places like Walkeshwar (actually it's more of a Marwari/Gujarati Jain ghetto - albeit a very gilded one). My aunt lives in Santacruz East, not far from the Khar station, and has always lived in a very mixed, cosmopolitan building with neighbors from across India (sadly this seems to be a declining trend in Bombay - witness the rapid rise of "vegetarians-only" apartment buildings).

The one case of terrorism outside of Gujarat that MAY have be more directed towards Gujaratis were the 2003 Gateway of India/Ghatkopar/Zaveri Bazar bombings in Bombay. Zaveri Bazar is indeed heavily Gujarati, as is Ghatkopar to an extent.

In this case, however, I think some in the Indian media are just speculating through the lense of their biases (not that what happened in Gujarat in 2002 shouldn't be condemned, both what happened in Godhra and what happened aftewards - but that is a different thread).

P.S.: Shoutout to GujuDude - your mentor in plane geekdom is proud of your commentary.

I would not rule out this angle totally.. Again lets hope investigations reveal the real cause/culprits

The bombs were planted in churchgate, where the trains start. So I guess, it would not have been difficult to plant the bombs in the second class compartments. The payback to the terrorists (the number of victims) would have been higher.

Some of the earlier bombs that went off (Zaveri bazaar) seemed to target Gujratis

The 2002 riots is still a big grievance for the muslims. So it is not difficult for some local muslims with real or imaginary grievances to plan and execute this.

As far as the whole of country getting involved, I am afraid not much will happen. Also, apart from Gujrat there are many states in India which deserve equal attention (Assam, North East, UP etc).

There are tons of theories floating around and all can rustle up evidence and appear plausible, but moneyed Gujaratis and diamond traders and stockbrokers do not take local trains, they take their cars. The suburbs targeted are by no stretch of the imagination the "wealthy" parts of town. Working people and small businessmen take the train.

The Maharashtra DGP has said, btw, that early media reports about the use of RDX are not backed by evidence yet, they are still doing forensic analysis and won't be able to say anything definitively for several days.

i find the ToI article by s. balakrishnan to be poorly sourced and far too speculative. yes, even if many gujaratis died in the blast, there is no way that this could have been pre-decided, local trains in mumbai are far too crowded to be able to choose your victims. as for the diamond merchants, as another commenter has pointed out, i hardly think they travel in local trains at peak time.

my own guess is that most people who died are salaried employees in the service sector and i'm also afraid that because the bombs went off in the first class, lots of college students may have died as well. (i remember my friends in college, who commuted all had a first-class pass, the railways give a hefty concession to students who then tend to travel in the first class because it tends to be a wee less crowded during peak time.)

that said, it makes no difference whether they were planted in the first or second class compartments. at peak times the number of people in each are almost the same. my own guess is that it was probably easier to plant the bombs there since these compartments are pretty deserted, during off-peak hours.

Sources said the aim apparently was to hit moneyed Gujaratis, many of whom stay in suburbs of Vile Parle, Kandivli, Malad and Borivli along the Western Railway and travel first class.
i can't even imagine what this means. even if "moneyed Gujaratis" stay at vile parle, kandivili, malad and borivili note that people who are on these trains do not all intend to disembark at these stations. besides "moneyed" people do not take local trains.

i'm not saying that these bombings could not have been retaliation for gujarat. all i'm saying is that the evidence that you quoted (the ones cited by the articles you mention) is purely circumstantial -- actually no, its downright speculative and could only be considered evidence if one looked at it through a pre-drawn conclusion: that the blasts were retaliation for gujarat.

GujuDude at #12:

From the Deafening Silence thread, I had said:

If this attack came from Non Kashmiri Indian Muslims, where did they get the superior technology to succeed on such a scale. Our ever present neighbor, having aided many other Locals in their aspirations, no doubt was willing to give a helping hand.

"...it was confirmed from the remains of shattered bogies that the explosives used were of "very high intensity and could probably be RDX." Union Home Secretary V K Duggal

My mistake was in assuming that because RDX was not manufactured in India and LeT and other terrorists are frequently arrested for bringing it into the country, that it was probably difficult to get RDX unless aided by a foreign terrorist organization.

You set me straight regarding the availability of RDX and it's low technology:

Um, high explosives* like RDX (as the article describes high intensity, whatever that is) are fairly common and NOT high tech. They've been around for a long time and are widely available on the black markets. Seriously, I don't understand how you can come to a conclusion that this was a high tech weapon. All you really need is timing device (cell phones, set timers, etc) to set off some blasting caps(also very common) and viola! An explosion.

The very reason such bombs, IEDs, whatever are used is because they are low tech. One can add high tec components, but at the core explosives are very, very, very, low tech. If you've watched Discovery Times/military channel, then you may have seen an episode called Hunting The Taliban. There is one scene where the Army Special Forces have caught bomb making material. All of it came from Pakistan and there was a basket full of Nokia cell phones stripped down to make bombs. The bomb maker ran the border to Pakistan as explicitly stated by the Special Forces troops in the documentary.

*High Explosives: These detonate, which means they react supersonically creating a shock wave that pulverizes its surroundings. Examples are RDX, C4, TNT, PETN...

* Low Explosives: These deflagrate, which means they burn and combust. Examples: Black poweder, propellants (used to accelerate bullets, mortars, artillery)

As usual, wiki to the rescue on Explosives.

Still have not found anything to suggest the wide availability of RDX on the black market. I would appreciate it if you could expand on that.

There is also a Bengali connection! The tourists murdered in Srinagar on 7/11 were Bengalis! Also UP and Delhi connections, if you consider the earlier bombings in Benares and Delhi.

It is astonishing how you Indians want to rationalize the jihadi campaign against you!

Martin,
I totally agree with you. Why the hullaboo about the motive or rational behind the attacks? A crazed mind doesnt need reason to kill.

Many places in Mumbai have a large Gujarati population. eg: Mulund, Bhandup and Ghatkoper on the Central Railways side. Yes more Gujaratis travel first class on the railways in general... that is because there are more Gujarati businessmen in Mumbai in the first place.

And there is a more obvious reason for choosing first class which I think has been discussed b4 (lesser people around to spot them).

One more point.. the bomb blasts in 93 took place after the riots... and not the other way round. People are not that foolish to start rioting after such a major incident... I think even the SS realizes the need for maturity.

The Guys from Mumbai Help have uploaded a list of casualties on their wiki.

I think, before we start spreading rumors about how the rich Gujaratis may have been the target of the blasts, it is necessary to go through this list and actually count the number of Gujarati/non-Gujarati names here. In Borivili, which has a significant Gujarati population, I could count 7 Gujarati sounding names out of 48 casualties. If you peruse through the list of names from other hospitals, there seem to be an equal distribution of people from all classes.

If you have travelled the Bombay locals, at 6.30 in the evening, even in the first class compartments, you would know that the crowd is not Gujarati dominated. It has as many stock borkers and diamond merchants as it has college kids, service professionals and muslim merchants from Mohammad Ali Rd. The locals, peak hours and crowds do not discriminate based on caste, class or religion. Not even based on money - because the first-class compartment carrying rich-gujurati-folk is a myth, and a lot of "rich" folk prefer to travel second-class because it is a lot less crowded than the first (only 1 first-class compartment - as against 7/9 second-class compartments).

So let us be more careful before we lend credibility to such theories by publishing it here on SM.

My mistake was in assuming that because RDX was not manufactured in India and LeT and other terrorists are frequently arrested for bringing it into the country, that it was probably difficult to get RDX unless aided by a foreign terrorist organization.

I don't know if India produces RDX, and if it does, it is probably a closesly watched government controlled operation. India has a self sufficient and very large ordnance infrastructure. I highly doubt it isn't produced there since RDX is the foundation for every type of composition plastic explosive (A-5,C-4,Comp B..). However, checks and balances probably ensure it stays within the military.

It would most definitely have to be smuggled in. When I said availability on the black market, I meant the international arms markets, not necessarily the typical Indian black markets. Let me make an analogy here: Think of RDX like opium. Afghanistan is he worlds largest producer of illicit opium. India is the worlds largest legal opium producer. Most of India's opium goes into producing medical stuff.

That opium on the drug markets will find it's way into various locations through out the world. Similarly raw material for the drug Meth was purchased from one of India's chemical companies legally by Mexican drug cartels (they stopped selling once they found out it wasn't a pharma company buying the stuff). This ingredient was then used to produce meth in superlabs/smaller shops for the American market flooding it with highly addictive meth. Not necessarily high technology, but definitely interesting logistics. Smugglers are an efficient bunch.

If this attack came from Non Kashmiri Indian Muslims, where did they get the superior technology to succeed on such a scale.

You see, if you amended the above sentence to say "superior logistics" instead of technology, I don't think we would have got into any debate here.

Pakistan Ordnance Factories produces explosives, so do Chinese manufacturers, and many, many, more. Just like AK's and 7.62mm ammuntion is widely available, so are explosives.

When you have a surplus on the market from munitions of older wars laying around and nations with 'loose' controls on it's military industrial complex, you see EOD clearning quantities as shown in this picture from Afghanistan. It isn't really hard for arms dealers to get their hands on this stuff.

Martin:

You are absolutely right about Indian media trying to find some kind of justification to this horrible *CRIME*. It is not even funny anymore to watch how the media still wanna deal the home grown militants with kiddy-gloves. This operation cannot be carried out by Pak based ISI or Arabi AQ alone without the help of Indian citizens. For once, stop seeing vote bank in all. Stop DISRESPECTING majority of law-abiding, patriotic citizens of India who happen to be muslims. I am sure they can handle the truth, if you give them an oppurtunity to.

Sorry about the typo in the name section of my previous post. I was trying to address him and wrote Martin's name when I should have written mine.

I hope people wont start guessing that Martin and I are the same person :)

cheers
-P

abhi,

Its really disappointing to find you give credence to such nonsense. This "news" belongs to the "4000 jews took the day off" category. I lived many years in Bombay and I can tell you that if you want to target Gujarati's there a million better ways of doing it.

In light of Israel's maniacal attempts at flattening Lebanon/Gaza with overt statements by their leaders to the like of 'we want to give them pain', ' we want to make it hard', 'nothing is safe'................India in response looks even more reasonable with its measured and civilized response to the rather barbarian attack in Bombay.

Good job Vijit..

I was so pissed off by this blog and the uncritiqued TOIlet paper of India's news report that I went through the names of all the dead. It's painful to read familiar names.. names that many of the victims share with my friends and relatives.

I counted about 11 muslims among the 200 odd dead and not more than 17 Gujaratis.

Martin, thanks for standing up. I guess we should be happy that Balakrishnan didn't point to the absence of jews in the list of the murdered and put the blame on them. I suppose our little Eichmanns had it coming, eh?

Abhi, This Balakrishnan character is a [i]reporter[/i].. that too for the worst rag of a newspaper in India. This is a blog, a relatively good one at that.. couldn't you have atleast gone through the list of the murdered and verified what this guy was saying?

abhi,

Its really disappointing to find you give credence to such nonsense.

I've dissapointed a lot of people in life I'm sure. Please read my post. I tried to be as clear as I could that given the source (ToI) I am not ready to believe this yet. There are a lot of facts though that make this line of reasoning just as credible as blaming Pakistan or Al Qaeda or Kashmiri militants right off the bat.

I am waiting for the Indian government's findings the same as you. Feel free to post those findings in the comment section. As I stated, I do hope that this theory is wrong.

In light of Israel's maniacal attempts at flattening Lebanon/Gaza with overt statements by their leaders to the like of 'we want to give them pain', ' we want to make it hard', 'nothing is safe'................India in response looks even more reasonable with its measured and civilized response to the rather barbarian attack in Bombay.

Not to get drawn off-topic, but this is not an accurate comparison. Israel enjoys a huge military advantage over its neighbors, and it can exercise "escalation control". India does not have that with Pakistan - it is Islamabad which has escalation control, thanks to its nuclear shield. Israel's actions this past week are excessive (which I've commented on at Dan Drezner's blog), and they do complicate matters for the U.S. But Israel's excessive action does not make India's excessive inaction admirable.

Now, back to the main point of the post - this idea that Gujaratis were specifically targetted does not seem to be substantiated.

And another thing. Blogs are a place for discussion. If you think the ToI articles are shit (and they may well be) then you can't do much on the ToI website but you can complain about it here. Stop holding bloggers up to the same standards that you do journalists. If I had the time to do all the research some of you expect then I should be getting paid for this as a job. As it stands I will be running science experiments the entire day today.

We aren't journalists. This is a place for our opinions and thoughts and they aren't always going to be correct.

KXB,
You are right about the relative difference of power between Indian and Pakistan compared to Israel versus Lebanon.
However there is nothing stopping India from dropping 250lb bombs on Shalimar Bagh.
I have always been very critical of India’s treatment of its minorities. However India does deserve credit for not inflicting collective punishment on the people who live in the Kashmir valley. Israel’s insanity stands in stark contrast to India’s growing political maturity/responsibility. It is a sign that India wants to be taken seriously at the global level.
Kudos!

Al Mujahid,
"However there is nothing stopping India from dropping 250lb bombs on Shalimar Bagh."

Nothing except the fact that Shalimar Bagh is a part of India, and dropping a bomb there would result in the deaths of mostly Indian citizens. Do you honestly think the Indian government would bomb its own citizens, muslim, hindu or otherwise?? The answer is no, so therefore the appearance of restraint and reasonability deal with India's lack of action towards external facilitators of terrorism, who in India's case happend to be "certain" Islamic countries whether we like it or not. While I agree that a certain amount of restraint is necessary to keep the situation from spiraling out of control, I'm not sure I agree with the current total lack of purpose and action that we are seeing and mark my words will see in the future regarding this incident. If there is concrete evidence that an external power was involved in this attack, and I stress if I think India must take some sort of action even if it is severely limited. A message has to be sent, a proactive message not more meaningless rhetoric about not being cowed down by terrorists. India taking this type of action by no means makes it irresponsible, violent, or anti-islamic, on the other hand it does show that the country means business and those who are involved in these attacks should now worry about Indian retaliation in a physical sense not just moral and verbal.

In light of Israel's maniacal attempts at flattening Lebanon/Gaza

Yes, Israel is the maniac. After all they started the whole thing. No wait, it was Hezbollah and Hamas with support from Syria and Iran. As TNR editors put it moral depravity needs to be dealt with forcefully.

What did you expect Israel to do? Wait and sign more peace accords.

I wish India, and only after the perpetrators of the Mumbai train bombings are caught, acts with a massive amount of force and gives them pain. Appeasement will not work with these people. Israel has the right idea and let us learn from them.

If there is concrete evidence that an external power was involved in this attack, and I stress if I think India must take some sort of action even if it is severely limited

I agree.

Israel has the right idea and let us learn from them

and they are so successful...................

No wait, it was Hezbollah and Hamas with support from Syria and Iran.

Which is why they attack and invade Lebanon. Makes sense.

Wow, self-proclaimed Zionist Martin Peretz and The New Republic writing in defence of Israel? What next, American Sportsman supporting handgun ownership?

Which is why they attack and invade Lebanon. Makes sense.

I am not justifying Israel's strong arm tactics.

However,

Hezbollah operates out of Lebanon. Even, the extreme militant wing of Hamas is Lebanon based. Every one is.........

Let's focus on Mumbai on this thread.

Let's focus on Mumbai on this thread.

Agreed.

In the next 3 days, Israel will quite possibly kill more civilians than the people killed in the Bombay bomb blasts. (50 civilians already killed today in Lebanon, mostly christians btw)
Its unfortunate that some budding brown wannabe zionists will cheer this macabre spectacle of death and destruction.

Let's focus on Mumbai on this thread.

Agreed.

Agrees too!
Please direct future Zionist tripe to al_mujahid_for_debauchery@yahoo.com

However,

Hezbollah operates out of Lebanon. Even, the extreme militant wing of Hamas is Lebanon based.

But Lebanon is not Hezbollah or Hamas run. Should any India-based terrorist organization be conflated with India itself?

Okay, done. :)

But it's hard to remain on topic with WWIII unfolding before our eyes.

"But Lebanon is not Hezbollah or Hamas run."

From bbc:

"Hezbollah now has an important presence in the Lebanese parliament and has built broad support by providing social services and health care. It also has an influential TV station, al-Manar."

so it's incorrect to imply that it's a rogue element using Lebanon territory instead of one that has political support there.

p.s: this is not to say that israel is an angel. but in this particular incident, it looks like hezbollah transgressed first.

Depending on who you are, you will ascribe the motivation behind the blasts. If you are disgruntled about Kashmir, then the reason is Kashmir. If you are disgruntled about Pak menace, you will scream that Mush personally ordered the blasts. If you are right wing hindu, you will be sure it is the centuries old confrontation between muslims and kaffirs. Gujarat is an entire industry in itself, specially for MSM. If they could, they'd even pin 1993 bombings on John Connor rising from the 2002 Gujarat riots.

"Hezbollah now has an important presence in the Lebanese parliament and has built broad support by providing social services and health care. It also has an influential TV station, al-Manar."

so it's incorrect to imply that it's a rogue element using Lebanon territory instead of one that has political support there.

Fine, change my statement to "Should the Communist Party of India be conflated with India itself?" The point still stands. They're a minority party, not the ruling party.

Look, it's the best I could think of to illustrate why I believe they're overreacting.

(And "overreacting" does NOT mean "they shouldn't react at all.)

Abhi, this is exactly when its important to remember that media is plural, and highly fragmented, especially in India. Of the four sources you cite, the most credible is The Hindu--and the least supportive of the angle. Just reread ToI's copy again----gossipy, implicative tone is not a sign of hard core reporting. If I'm asked to believe "sources" then I need to trust that the publication has a strong fact checking apparatus. ToI's gossipy, implicatory tone alone speaks of lack of reporting. These newspapers are all very different from each other, and you should consider listing each one right there in the citation. Color me thoroughly skeptical.

Ah yes, I've been waiting for this. the first inkling of a redirection of blame back on to Hindus. And it only took two days. There should be gambling odds on these things, the secularists are impulsive when it comes to redirection of Islamic terrorism onto Hindus.

Yeah - blame the gujjus. That was quick.

I am glad respondents have disagreed with the overall direction of this article. I think self-analysis is a good thing but not self-blame in the context of an atrocity. In fact, the astonishing thing is that exactly this kind of logic is used by communal/sectarian folk but instead of self-blame it focusses on the other! IMHO, both are bogus !

I encourage people interested in understanding the new phase of Jihad in India to read Praveen Swami in the Hindu. He has the clearest analysis of the recent sequence of terrorist killings in the indian heartland.

Meet some of Mumbai's saviours

Bombay cops rule out RDX in the blasts: http://ww3.mid-day.com/news/city/2006/july/140547.htm

Check your facts, dude. And if that's the reason, then it justifies the bombay railway bombings, right? Shame on you ...

It's irrelevent if Hezbollah is a minority party. The Lebanese government allows them to control southern Lebanon unmolested, from where Hezbollah has safe haven to launch attacks.

"If this violence is related to the state of affairs in Gujarat then all of India better get involved now. India can no longer allow the status quo (e.g. poor leadership, unaddressed concerns on both sides) in Gujarat to continue"

Can you please elaborate? Are you suggesting that alleged "poor leadership" etc in Gujarat justifies the macabre killings in Mumbai's trains? I hope that's not what you are saying.

To the touthor of this post -
I am assuming that you are an American of Indian origin?
That is the only thing, which can excuse you of such utter idiocy.

OTOH, I finally understand the origin of the [much deserved] label - ABCD.

reminds of an old hindi proverb, which would be quite apt under the circumstances - dhobi ka kuta, na ghar ka na ghat ka....

Al Mujahideen for Debauchery

It is very easy to make those comments about 'maturity of Indian polity' leading a plush life in the United States. The trouble with India is not terrorists but people conscious of their inferiority complex always seeking to impress and keep an image on the world stage, particularly their western hosts. Our enemies senses that and cuntries that fit in our armpits have the impunity to strike at civilians at rush hour on Hindu festivals

Abhi - shame on you for your "don't hold me to journalistic standards".

Sure, may be we should not expect you to hold even standards of simple logic. Your opinion is insulated to even a list of names of casualties.

What do you want? A private interview with the terrorists to convince you that they targeted Gujaratis or not?

This Sunday Express reporter actually did some legwork and brainwork before offering an explanation as to why the bombs were placed where they were.

Our enemies senses that and cuntries that fit in our armpits have the impunity to strike at civilians at rush hour on Hindu festivals

Yes, but you have nuclear armpits ;)

My point is not to commend India on how it deals with Pakistan. My point was to commend India on how it deals with the valley (as the Kashmiris apparently set up the blasts).

i hope that india make kashmir and gujrat independence, we dont want them states..its causing to much damage to indian economy
i hope our goverment makes them independece

India deserved it for funding and training the LTTE.

Miss Shafraz,

FYI - India has not supported LTTE for more than a decade. Indeed, the Indian govt would love to get their hands on the top LTTE management,, so they may prosecute them for Rajiv Gandhi's murder.

Btw, ever heard of the IPKF? If not, you seriously need to finish or maybe start your education, Miss.....really.

What's so great about the IPKF? The IPKF raped countless Tamil women and killed innocent civilians. It is known as the Indian People Killing Force.

"..the Indian Army came here, massacred innocent Tamil civilians, raped our women and plundered our valuables. The acronym IPKF will always stand for Indian People Killing Force where we are concerned. We will one day erect a memorial in the heart of Jaffna town, in the centre of Hospital Road, in memory of all the innocent civilians – ranging in age from the very old past 80 to young children massacred by the IPKF and to the women who were raped."

http://www.tamilnation.org/intframe/india/warcrimes/040321somasekeram.htm

i think gujeratis were paritcularly targetted
all gujjus send their money back to their state and families. All the more they even send money to the gujerat government and hindu political parties. To target these gujju business men in bombay would be quite reasonable, as they are the ones who send money back to their native land.
Gujerat comprises of many dominant hindu communities --starting wid the Gujjus offcourse, the sindhis/baluchis, the kucchis, the lohanas, the maharashtrians. The gujjus are yet a strong staunch hindu community, and many gujjus and sindhis are pro-hindus because they have seen the days of bloodshed and parition during pre-partition era. They've gotta be fanatic hindus and definitely either a VHP or BJP!
a state that had once flourished with diverse unique culture, comprising of the parsis,the boris, the gujju muslims, the potuguese, is nowa cradle for fanatic hindu communities. No body wishes to repeat the history of the good-old karachi days!
please do not listen to that L.K. Advani and people of his background, they are very fanatic,gujerat is gujerat when it is united and diverse with economy!

are u being racist to the sindhis????!!
watch out man!
we do our business and live peacefully
we are sufis in our nature. Although many sindhis have joined many hindu political parties, but they are not the route cause of the gujju problem. The gujerat governor is yet a gujju--mind u, not a sindhi to decide for gujerat! how would we even initiate hindu fanatism

but honestly, if i had the chance then Yes i m a fanatic, unlike sufi sindhis, and if i were a governor of gujerat i would completely make it hindu. But in no case has a sindhi tried to excite fanatism in gujerat till yet---I M WAITING FOR ONE!!