That's so not the real story. I heard that Pakistan was talking shit about India to that bitch Armenia after volleyball practice last week. Then India was like, whatever, and Pakistan was like, yeah whatever bitch, and then India was SO like about to get ugly, and Pakistan totally backed the fuck down and then called Kazhakstan and was crying on the phone about India even though like she totally started it.

They totally used to be best friends.

Pakistan is one assassination - or one election - away from being an extreme Islamist state with a nuclear bomb. Under the circumstances, it makes sense for the US to support its Prime Minister, but without economic growth, rule of law, education, civil rights and all the other elements of democratic modernity, there's not much hope there.

Really I am tired of India and Pakistan behaving like a bunch of obstinate kids. We like to rave about our so called 5000 year old civilization, but we rarely show any signs of being civilized. And I am talking about my country India out here. Why couldn't we wait for a decent interval of time before expelling the Paki diplomat?
Pakistan may be wrong in expelling the Indian diplomat, but then two wrongs don't make a right.

You are right, Amrevis

We should learn from the civilized west.

yeah, learn from the west, bomb the bitch

yeah, learn from the west, bomb the bitch

LOL.. well said..
The urge to "civilize" others is directly proportional to the "military strength"..

Why couldn't we wait for a decent interval of time before expelling the Paki diplomat?

Amrevis / Kritic
What do you think India should have done instead?

Btw, if India needed a "senior Indian High Commission official" to sit at a chai kiosk and spy, we (Indians) have a lot to feel worried. :)

I wonder what would happen if say China or any of the Middle East countries tried to do the same to a civilized US / civilized western nation. Any thoughts?

here's how it will go. just like america has given israel the red light against the muslims in the mid east, it will do the same to india against pakistan. india is looking for reasons to disarm pakistan and the "militants" in kashmir. but what they dont realize is that pakistan isn't lebanon, and that it has the largest military of any muslim country, and that china is our backer. too many lives will be lost.

Now pakistan has a legit claim that the indian diplomat was spying, and india, to be a child, decided to kick the pakistani out for no reason. whatever it is, the two will be at war by october, and this one may get a little messy.

also i am surprised how pro india, pro hindu this blog really is. the majority of the readers ARE indian hindus, but that does not mean that it should be swayed towards them. in sepia mutiny's attempt to be a hipster, western webpage, they have also sold their objectiveness. as far as i, and many of my friends are concerned, this page is for indians, by indians. now i am sure a bunch of you guys will quote my stuff by copy pasting lines, but this is my opinion, and all the non hindu indians will probably agree.

Folks,
West or East ,expelling and counter expelling equal number of diplomats is a "normal Diplomatic" game , whatever be the reasons behind ; I don't get why some people are so upset

West or East ,expelling and counter expelling equal number of diplomats is a "normal Diplomatic" game , whatever be the reasons behind ; I don't get why some people are so upset

Right I just googled "Russia expels US diplomat" and found this
link

In Russia's first diplomatic tiff with Washington since the Cold War's end, Moscow expelled a senior American diplomat Monday in retaliation for last week's ouster of a Russian envoy to the United States.

The Russian Foreign Ministry identified diplomat James L. Morris, listed as a counselor at the U.S. Embassy in Moscow, as the CIA station chief here.

also i am surprised how pro india, pro hindu this blog really is.

Mashallah brother, it is a cesspool of pro *spit* Hindu cannibals and lingam worshippers.

the majority of the readers ARE indian hindus, but that does not mean that it should be swayed towards them. in sepia mutiny's attempt to be a hipster, western webpage, they have also sold their objectiveness.

So called westernised, so called hispter, so called Hindu, so called objectivity. What they need is lessons in objectivity from mujahids of truth like you and me.

as far as i, and many of my friends are concerned, this page is for indians, by indians. now i am sure a bunch of you guys will quote my stuff by copy pasting lines, but this is my opinion, and all the non hindu indians will probably agree.

For sure, you and I have the backing of rationality, objectivity, and all non *spit* Hindu Indians on our side. It's not like we need to point that up to bulk up our numbers because our MATURE TRUTH speaks for itself.

This place is disgusting and their attempt to be 'westernised' just shows up that they are really part of the anti-Pakistan Zionist conspiracy. Nothing is more disgusting than *spit* Hindu Indians being childish, except for Hindus *spit* from the West trying to be hip and westernised and trendy.

For sure, your friends are like Greek Gods pronouncing the law to the mortals, and these Sepia Muntiny so called 'hipsters' shall quake in their boots, at the knowledge of what your friends think, because you and they are too special.

Hail Al-Mogambo!

Now this seems to be something getting serious here. I dont understand on what grounds did India expelled the Pakistani officer. Though I know that every action has its reaction but the reaction could have been delayed and at an appropriate time for an appropriate person. I admit that pakistan is not Lebanon but for India, we surely can be like an Israel and teach Pakis a lifetime lesson. Its high time the Government should realize -- Mumbai Blasts, Akshardham attack, Delhi blasts, Day in day out attacks on our Kashmir -- the list can go on and on. Let's be like the west - the best.

we surely can be like an Israel and teach Pakis a lifetime lesson.

but this is my opinion, and all the non hindu indians will probably agree.

Including the CHRISTIAN who wrote it, right?

also i am surprised how pro india, pro hindu this blog really is. the majority of the readers ARE indian hindus, but that does not mean that it should be swayed towards them. in sepia mutiny's attempt to be a hipster, western webpage, they have also sold their objectiveness. as far as i, and many of my friends are concerned, this page is for indians, by indians.

ah, india and pakistan, pakistan and india. so much fun going back and forth. i don't know who the "indians" are that you are talking about. really, the authors of this site aren't indian. we are americans, and one canadian. we have roots in the subcontinent. we don't have citizenship of any country in the subcontinent, we simply have a cultural interest in the subcontinent and in its diaspora. if you find us "attempting to be western," it is simply because we are western.

you say the majority of our readers are indian hindus. i have no idea what the demographics of our readership are, aside from the geographical location of the hits; we've never done a survey. apparently you have. but the majority of hits we get are from the united states. i'm going to assume that most of our readers are american. i know nothing of their religious background nor their degree of religiosity.

now if we want to talk about extreme or jingoistic positions espoused by commenters, sure, we get more pro-india jingoism than pro-pakistan jingoism. and it's something we the bloggers here don't particularly like, and our founder has even posted on that very topic. the pro-india jingoism is made all the more pervasive and ugly by the fact that anti-muslim prejudice is basically countenanced and approved by mainstream politics and media in the west, which gives cover to anyone with an axe to grind against any person or government that happens to be muslim.

yes, it's ugly. yes, it's unpleasant. however, this is a space where we can talk about these things. your perspective is welcome as is that of all your friends. consider this a personal invitation to visit and comment and exchange. if you don't want to take us up on the invitation, perhaps you'd at least consider educating us to your point of view rather than just making broadside statements about how we are pro-this and pro-that. perhaps you could direct us to news sites or blogs that we might find interesting.

as the old rasta saying goes, "each one, teach one." i invite you to teach us, not make obnoxious blanket statements. you might be pleasantly surprised at the quality of the conversation we could have.

peace

I issue hearty applause in the general direction of SpoorKhan (who is Spoorlam's lost twin from the Kumbh Mela, I suppose) and Yeti.

Siddhartha:

your perspective is welcome as is that of all your friends. consider this a personal invitation to visit and comment and exchange.

I am on to you. First you forced out Manish. You've obviously killed Vinod. I shudder to think what you've done to MoorNam, and now SpoorLam has been replaced by SpoorKhan; as you invite the enemy of your enemy to "comment and exchange." I also suspect you're grooming the poetic Mr Kobayashi to replace Amardeep afer he mysteriously OD's on Tennessee Sour Mash during an SM meetup.

Your Parisian upbringing explains it all.

maybe that is the problem with this page sid, u and the sepia crew consider urself americans, and are western. but i and many others realize how biased and ignorant the west is, so enjoy being an american, it will continue to leave this site skewed and subjective.

there are no real ideas to exchange on this topic, what i am saying is true, u know it, i am not some ignorant pakistani who hates indians, i just hate this site for its skewed stance on things, and the commenters for their pro hindu stance. i love this page cuz it reports things u dont see in the random media, it is a service to us desis, but it is also slowed corrupting the readers to be anti-muslim and anti-pakistani.

ah, india and pakistan, pakistan and india. so much fun going back and forth. i don't know who the "indians" are that you are talking about. really, the authors of this site aren't indian. we are americans, and one canadian. we have roots in the subcontinent. we don't have citizenship of any country in the subcontinent, we simply have a cultural interest in the subcontinent and in its diaspora. if you find us "attempting to be western," it is simply because we are western.

you say the majority of our readers are indian hindus. i have no idea what the demographics of our readership are, aside from the geographical location of the hits; we've never done a survey. apparently you have. but the majority of hits we get are from the united states. i'm going to assume that most of our readers are american. i know nothing of their religious background nor their degree of religiosity...

f you don't want to take us up on the invitation, perhaps you'd at least consider educating us to your point of view rather than just making broadside statements about how we are pro-this and pro-that. perhaps you could direct us to news sites or blogs that we might find interesting.

Come now, Sid. You're begging for metacriticism by responding to that dude (who was totally within his rights, imo). Can't we simply say: yes, there's a current Indian-American bias in the space, you're working on it (or not, but who will know the difference?), and move on? :) I know I'm not subjecting myself to another 150 comments of sturm und drang!

Brother Faizan

By the power of Greyskull you are right! These cunning bania's are forming an anti Pakistan cabal by pretending to be hip and trendy Americans at the same time as slyly fomenting hatred against the ummah with their pro *spit* Hindu policies. You have worked these scumbags out, They are worthy of your truthful hate.

Hail al-Mogambo!

anti-muslim prejudice is basically countenanced and approved by mainstream politics and media in the west, which gives cover to anyone with an axe to grind against any person or government that happens to be muslim.

Good point Sid. I think the line between valid criticism and knee jerk hate mongering was crossed long ago when it comes to debate on Muslims.

Manju (#18)

I also suspect you're grooming the poetic Mr Kobayashi to replace Amardeep...

Grooming is right. OK, back to training.

A better link. All this linking is making me hungry...

You're begging for metacriticism by responding to that dude (who was totally within his rights, imo). Can't we simply say: yes, there's a current Indian-American bias in the space, you're working on it (or not, but who will know the difference?), and move on?

of course he is totally within his rights. that's why i took the time to respond, silly. and those who know/read me will know that maybe i, like, don't totally disagree with his point, know'm saying? in fact, it's clear from my acknowledgment that we get a lot more pro-India jingoism here than the other way round.

but just because i might actually agree with the brother on some of his criticism is no reason for me to let him off the hook about contributing something. sniping from the sidelines reduces him to the level of those his criticizes. contribute something, dammit! this zero-sum notion that either you're pro-India or you're pro-Pakistan, either you're pro-Hindu or you're pro-Muslim, basically replicates the shrivelled, pathetic logic of the warmongers and haters in both countries.

we don't have to follow that example. asking that argument be positive-sum not zero-sum is a perfectly legitimate request. like i said earlier, "each one, teach one."

peace

you can't go wrong with a rasta vibration

See what businessmen upto

Faizan,

It seems you might be going a bit extreme in your assumptions. I am new to the Sepia community but have been impressed with the caliber and rationality of discussion, as well as with the wittiness factor. From what I have read, the readers and bloggers are not as biased as you claim. In fact, several people pointed out that India and Pakistan need to make amends and stop acting childish to one another. I really don’t see how that is pro-Hindu or pro-India.

sheila, u shut urself down when u said u were new to this page, i have been reading this page for 2 years now, and it took me time to come to this valid conclusion.

sid, i respect you for admitting to the bias, and respect that you are working on it.

Faizan,

Granted you have been reading this blog longer than I have, that doesn't automatically make your conclusion valid. Please help me understand how the above article was pro-Hindu or pro-India. I didn't see that at all.

notice the first source quotes is "the hindu". where are the pakistani newspapers? like "jaang" and international award winning paper, that i have never see quotes on this site.

A group of about eight to nine people pounced on Kaul when he was having tea at a kiosk on Islamabad-Lahore Highway at 7:30 am IST, while on his way to Wagah border to receive his family, officials at the Indian High Commission in Islamabad said.
“He was stopped by Pakistani security agencies and taken, hooded and handcuffed to some unidentified location where he was interrogated intermitently for about five hours,” MEA spokesman, Navtej Sarna, told reporters. -

notice they only describe the way the savage muslims detained the indian, why diddnt they describe the circumstances in such detail for the pakistani?

that is two points in a short article. read other and u will see, it's pretty clear if u take ur "indian beer goggles" off.

on this site, if a muslim criticizes something, the commenters break him down, try to make him look like a crazy extremist to negate his point, well this is one muslim ur not gonna do that to.

im sorry if i my diction is messed up, i actually just woke up. i dont usually type like that

Faizan,

on this site, if a muslim criticizes something, the commenters break him down, try to make him look like a crazy extremist to negate his point,

Presumably you are not familiar with MoorNam or his nemesis SpoorLam ;)

Sepia Mutiny, both the bloggers and the commenters, attack anyone who appears to be irrational or extremist in their views, regardless of the latter's religious affiliation. There have been several precedents of people from multiple religions -- not just Islam -- being on the receiving end of such treatment.

Faizan,

I don't know if you are checking this anymore, but I wanted to point out the blogs over the past couple days that have been very pro-Muslim. It seems that Sepia bloggers are pretty much unanimous in their criticism of racial profiling against people just because they are of the Islamic religion.

I really understand what is wrong in racial profiling. If 99% of Jihad related terrorism is by muslims, it is but obvious that Muslims must be profiled. Do you want to profile a Christian or a Budhist or a Jew or a Hindu just for the heck of it? Just to keep the Islamists happy? Every muslim was happy when 9/11 happened. There were a few crocodile tears from them though.