My method of pouring a date a glass of two-buck-chuck from Trader Joe's hasn't been working all that well. I may need to buy this book.

Alpana is also married to Charles Blackstone, Chicago's hipster of all hipsters.

Alpana is fabulous and very well known in wine connoisseur circles...OK I realize that sounded snooty but she's endearing because she's got a really warm personality unlike the general dry snobbery that accompanies people who love and know about wine and she very openly and willingly shares unlike the posers.

But I do agree with her outlook, good wine can make or break a good conversation/evening whether it's a date or with friends. I'll plug my favorite recommendations in NYC:
Metrocafe & Winebar
Bar Veloce
Morell Wine Bar
Divine Bar
Punch & Judy

More later...

I love 2 buck chuck! If my husband ordered a $490 bottle of wine I'd have a caniption. Honestly, it wouldn't have impressed me a bit while we were dating. I was happy going to a hole in the wall restaurant in SF's Chinatown where our waitress was mad kooky and the people around us provided entertainment.

FWIW, one of the (near-)celebrity sommelier's over here on the left coast is also desi - Rajat Parr at Michael Mina -

Born in Calcutta, Parr credits his uncle in London for first introducing him to great wines. At 31 years old, Parr is an ardent wine educator who has been invited to host seminars as well as lead panel discussions at several of the country's most prestigious food and wine gatherings. He enjoys creating and hosting wine dinners that share his love of wine with others.

Is there such thing as a Sake Sommelier? That's what I'd like to be. Oh who am I kidding, I'd just make sake bombs anyways. I'm convinced that this is a better approach to finding the right girl. If it works I'll write a book and let you all know.

Sake Sommelier

Points for alliteration -- love it.

I'm totally going to check her book out. I spent so many years claiming to love merlot (when I really didn't) and secretly avoiding learning anything about wine because it seemed too time consuming to learn about it properly. I was spurned into learning more by "Sideways" (no matter what I am not drinking any f***ing merlot!!!) and realized that there are tons of great options out there. Props to Alpana. I'm already a fan :)

two buck chuck has some new competition at trader joe's from this wine called "barefoot." It's kinda good and their logo is a footprint. worth a try for $4.

Rajat Parr went to the same hotel school as I did back in India. He looks like one of the few that stuck in the industry. I can't contain myself, I'm going to have to e-mail all my friends and let them know that doing a degree in Hospitality is'nt all that bad.

Another alumnus of the Welcomgroup program seems to be doing well in the UK too.

I was spurned into learning more by "Sideways" (no matter what I am not drinking any f***ing merlot!!!)

Never say never. Some of the world's greatest wines are 65% to 100% merlot. If you've ever enjoyed a St. Emilion or a Pomerol, two major classes of Bordeaux that include the world's most expensive wine, Chateau Petrus, then you've enjoyed a merlot.

The problem with the merlots flooding the market in the last few years is the same as the problem with chardonnay in the late 1980s and early 1990s. A particular grape becomes popular thanks to some good marketing or a lucky hit by a particular large-scale (Mondavi, Beringer, Gallo, etc) manufacturer, and then everyone rushes to produce one without regard for quality, and gets away with charging ridiculous prices. The phenomenon feeds on itself until the rift between quality and price becomes too preposterous, at which point something else becomes fashionable. Just like with any other product.

It's easier to produce these miscellaneous crowd-pleasing wines in the US, Australia, Chile or Argentina, where there are fewer local traditions let alone regulations to deal with. In addition, the so-called "new world" wines often come from very warm climates (California, parts of Australia) where the sun ripens the grapes very strongly, resulting in wines that are very fruit-forward. You get a heavy dose of whatever the basic characteristics of the wine are, and much less of the structure or subtlety.

I could go on.

tunatinis? eewwww!!! (has anyone ever had one of these?)

rieslings ... yummy

My method of pouring a date a glass of two-buck-chuck from Trader Joe's hasn't been working all that well. I may need to buy this book.

Or switch labels. If it looks better, it should taste better right? RIGHT? [The Red 2 buck chucks are bad. Stick with the whites, relatively speaking.]

On a similar note, if you have crappy cheap vodka, run it through a brita filter 4-5 times. It won't turn into grey goose, but atleast it won't be nail polish either. Just rubbing alcohol.

Mmmmm. I love eating raisins. A true delight!

Looking super hot in a really expensive dress can be immediately undermined if you order a diet cola.

What a snob. Seriously.

I mean, really, it's great she knows all this about wines and stuff, respect to her for that. But why does this whole wine thing have to be a criterion for judging someone else? Call me an uncouth unrefined rustic, what's the real difference between someone who knows a lot about different wines and for instance, the auto mechanic who knows the characteristics of the engines of different cars? Why is one thing considered so much more refined etc than others?

Ok, honestly, please tell me how many of you can really taste every little difference between wines (besides the obvious differences) and how many of you choose a wine to impress just because it's expensive. Sure, there's good wines, bad wines (just like food), but isn't this wine as a judgement of personality taking things a bit too far?????

As a thought experiment, I wonder how the quoted statement would change if a diet cola cost $200 per glass at that particular restaurant?

Not to mention the fact that the movie Sideways has had a secondary effect that is VERY bad for the environment:

In the fog-shrouded forests of California's remote North Coast, winemakers believe they've found the perfect terrain to grow the notoriously fickle pinot noir grape prized by connoisseurs.

Vineyard developers are snapping up thousands of acres of redwoods and firs in Sonoma County, with plans to clear the trees and plant the once-obscure varietal made famous by the wine-fueled road trip film ``Sideways.''

Environmentalists and residents in Annapolis, a tiny town about 140 miles north of San Francisco, are trying to rein in the pinot lovers. They're fighting the conversion of timberlands into vineyards, which they say destroys wildlife habitat, erodes the soil, contaminates the water with pesticides and opens the door to development.

``If you've seen the movie, you've seen the glassy-eyed stare they have when they talk about their plans to produce pinot noir up here,'' said resident Chris Poehlmann, who opposes vineyard conversions. ``We feel it's much more important for future generations to have forests on these hills than wine grapes.'' [Link]

In addition to learning about wine, generally, from Alpana Singh, you might want to dry desi wine, created by a Stanford grad who went back to India and became a vinter. I've tried it--not bad. http://www.stanfordalumni.org/news/magazine/2004/janfeb/dept/bright.html

technophobicgeek -- I'm so with you on this. I can taste the difference between bad and good wine. But most of the medium range wines -- whatever, I'm totally cool with it. I think it's all about taste and preference. I suppose I too am a uncouth unrefined rustic.

For those of you at Cornell or planning to go there, take their wine 'class'. I regret not taking it, though the local wineries provided enough fuel for inebriated wine tasting tours.

please tell me how many of you can really taste every little difference between wines (besides the obvious differences)

It's as obvious as the difference between a $500 suit and a $3,000 one, natch.

Good point Abhi. The good news is that pinot noir will not take so easily to becoming a trend wine. Sideways came out several years ago and we're not swimming in pinot noir. That's because it's a notoriously fickle grape, very finicky. US winemakes have been trying to make good pinor noir for ages and it only works in a few places, like Carneros (southern bit of Sonoma county, on the SF Bay) or parts of Oregon. Even in those cases, it's never had the complexity, let alone aging potential, of the only true great pinot noirs -- and boy are they great -- which are red Bourgognes (French Burgundy).

ani, technophobicgeek

I suppose I too am a uncouth unrefined rustic.

and may I add that I am proud.

What a snob. Seriously.

Oh but what a clever marketer! The whole point is to create a certain kind of anxiety and then offer (for a small price) to rid people of that anxiety.

technophobicgeek,

:D

sometimes you have to order the diet cola, too much vino will not make you look superhot in a dress

too much vino will not make you look superhot in a dress

Depends who is drinking the wine and who is wearing the dress.

p.s. does wine have the dreaded carbs?

I suppose I too am a uncouth unrefined rustic.

There are some good wines that could be described as "uncouth, unrefined, rustic." It depends on the setting and the meal! I'd rather have an uncouth wine than some streamlined crowdpleaser. Costs less, too.

I may not be a relationship expert, but I saw five years of relationships” by advising couples on wine.

Sure, relationships between great-looking super-rich white-couple people who can pay $500 for a wine bottle. Very representative, I'm sure.
Please forgive if I sound snark...I am definitely bitter I am not a good-looking-rich-white guy now.

How COOOOOL.

Now this is a book I will definately buy- and I LOVE the cover. No mangoes or mehndi, or red, brown or orange colors. Just Alpana pouring some wine.

You are so right Deep, Lahiri does come up in the oddest of places.

the dreaded carbs?

she was a guest speaker at the NETIP conference this past year in Chitown..alas, I was asleep when she presented at um.. 10am.. ;)... too bad..i think 90% of the conference participants missed her speak...I say this as I sip my diet coke..and no, i'm not ashamed of it either....

Good wine can make or break a good conversation/evening whether it's a date or with friends.

Isn't it about the date or the friends? Meaning, if the friends or the date were interesting in themselves, it wouldn't matter if you had fancy wine or Diet Coke.

don't know what happened to my comment above...

anyways, its just the calories ... i can have 2-3 glasses of wine with dinner, it doesn't mean that i should ...

btw, i

I found that the subtle oak and cinnamon flavor in the 2006 version of Boone's Farm goes well with the Philly Steak and Cheese Hot Pockets. However if Ramon Noodles are your meal of choice then I suggest shot of Mad Dog 40-40.

wtf?

why is everything being eaten up? ... must be the man telling me to get my ass back to work

I can taste the difference between bad and good wine. But most of the medium range wines -- whatever, I'm totally cool with it. I think it's all about taste and preference

I'm with you on that... I have found $8 bottles of Shiraz that taste TONS better than the $75 Burgundy I had couple weeks ago that smelled like dirty socks. It's weird that DRINKS go in and out of style like hemlines; I have always just ordered what I liked. I hated Merlot before hating Merlot was cool. It reminded me of the Communion wine in church that would always go sour but we'd have to use anyway *shudder*

My husband has tried a few times to introduce me into the ways of wine snobbery, and all I have learned is that you do not hold red wine glasses by the bowl. I think this would be a book he would enjoy :) Thanks for the tip!

And what does Alpana have to say about people who don't drink or ar not connoisseurs of fine wines, are they unsophisticated idiots !! The whole business of cringing at the sight of "unsure women" who order diet coke is beyond my understanding. is it a must that one has to have wine on a date. this whole thing reeks of stereotyping and snobbery.

I'd have to forgo the diet coke and opt for my beloved Coca-cola Zero. Drinking fine soda is an art.

Ok, honestly, please tell me how many of you can really taste every little difference between wines

i've dined at some of the world's finest reataurants many times and have drank a lot of wine in my time, but i still can't taste the differences in any meaningful way. so i don't bother with expensive wine anymore. but i once passed a blind whisky test with flying colors. and i can tell the differnce between a $5 and $15 slice of Toro from a mile away. so i do believe the wine empress is actually wearing new clothes.

i agree that the "diet coke" comment sounds like true snobbery. i went to a wine/cheese tasing class at artisinal last year and the instructor told us that the average person will never taste all the intricacies in that expensive bottle of wine to really be able to appreciate it. he advised us to stay in the mid-range mostly. and while the perfect wine has certainly completmented many a cozy night with my friends/family/significant other, I'd have to say that night would not be ruined without it. i feel like her statement undermines the importances of being funny/interesting/engaging on your own merits and letting your wine make the night.

but then again, i disagree with most "snag your perfect man now!" tips of the female self-help variety. no one ever relies on being themselves anymore it seems.

Me like beer (pounding chest).

On a more serious note, the whole wine-relationship analogy seems a bit much. On a less serious note, the fact that dating was mentioned in the post leads me to believe that there will be no less than 150 comments on this thread. Gentleman's bet, anyone (sorry, I couldn't come up with a gender neutral equivalent of "gentleman's bet")?

I'd have to forgo the diet coke and opt for my beloved Coca-cola Zero. Drinking fine soda is an art.

By personal experiences, I have found that once can pull many things off with the right amount of confidence and panache, regardless of the price on the drink.

Now this is a book I will definately buy- and I LOVE the cover. No mangoes or mehndi, or red, brown or orange colors. Just Alpana pouring some wine.

Yes, but this book does seem to pander to some stereotypes about women. As someone said above, "the whole point is to create a certain kind of anxiety and then offer (for a small price) to rid people of that anxiety." Sort of like Cosmopolitan magazine.

Looking super hot in a really expensive dress can be immediately undermined if you order a diet cola.

maybe i'm not as sophisticated, don't like the taste of wine, or would rather spare calories to things called CHOCOLATE (godiva turns 80 by the way for those chocoholics out there ;))... that quote just sounds pretty snotty... however i've heard she is pretty nice in person.. maybe it was a quote outta context? giving her the benefit..

nycer:

Isn't it about the date or the friends? Meaning, if the friends or the date were interesting in themselves, it wouldn't matter if you had fancy wine or Diet Coke.

amen to that. i don't think it should matter...and if it did...they are not meant for you.. conversation goes way beyond what you have to drink.. ... is that being uncouth? then i am unrefined.

Looking super hot in a really expensive dress can be immediately undermined if you order a diet cola.

This woman is projecting female standards of attraction onto the male psyche. Men don't judge women by their social status. We don't care.

Well, maybe Abhi would, but only because his date wouldn't be getting drunk.

Me like beer (pounding chest).

Wine is refin'd
But liquor is quicker.

Looking super hot in a really expensive dress can be immediately undermined if you order a diet cola.

To agree with Manju, but put it more simply, we rarely get beyond "Super Hot" and never past "dress". I can't remember the last time I noticed what a super hot chick was drinking, I just said, "Waiter, please send the lady another one"

Hmm, not only do I not drink wine, but I order a plain 'ol coke at restaurants! Oh ... I'm so ashamed.

For those of you at Cornell or planning to go there, take their wine 'class'. I regret not taking it, though the local wineries provided enough fuel for inebriated wine tasting tours.

I took the class, and the instructor (who is a pretty respected figure in the viticultural world) emphasized throughout that expensive wine is not always the best. We tasted everything from some of the best of Bordeaux to the local Finger Lake offerings, and the opinions were equally varied. Our instructor's favorite American wine was a $14 bottle from a vineyard down the road. I've been lucky enough to learn a good bit about wines and taste quite a few by now, and I can say that all that matters is what you like, not what other people think is good. It's like expert's taste in food, literature and movies: there is no objective standard of good taste.

Diet Coke sucks though. It's all about the original.

Siddhartha, Siddhartha, and finally SIDDHARTHA!

Wow. Sounds like someone needs to organize a Task Force outing, and soon. To help educate people like me and NYCer about the finer distinctions between uncouth crowdpleasers and streamlined fickle grapes. (Or whatever.) Maybe we could even have it in Brooklyn, a place where it's not-so-strange to run into Jhumpa Lahiri. (But of course, only if we have hours to kill getting there and back.)

Especially since you're playing Sanjay Dutt these days and all that. Vino-giri zindabad!

[NYC Task Forcers: I've recently investigated Masala Bollywood, reviewed in the NYT some weeks ago. Grey Lady's more or less got it right -- not the greatest, but better than average.]

Nudge nudge, Siddhartha. ;)

Looking super hot in a really expensive dress can be immediately undermined if you order a diet cola.

If I eat a hamburger while wearing a sari, am I undermining the look?

If I eat dhal, bath, rotli, shak while wearing jeans, am I undermining the look?

Siddhartha:

Where can I get a good baguette?

Where can I get a good baguette?

France.

Sounds like someone needs to organize a Task Force outing, and soon.

Or a full-fledged meetup.

I can say that all that matters is what you like, not what other people think is good

Exactly. The variation in wine (with respect to type, taste, and all the other stuff it gets ranked on) is so great, that people should try a bunch and drink what they like.

Wagner and Weimer up by seneca produced some nice wines. Though, I probably went to Lucas on Cayuga the most, simply because their wines weren't that expensive and definitely decent. Their "Tug Boat Red" was the most popular and is considered a white wine drinker's red. I thought it as ok, I brought a case to a New Years party once and girls guzzled it down.

..pause...

To set the news by Amardeep in perspective, here's a FAQ:

4. How many Master Sommeliers are there? How many are women?

There are 79 professionals who hold the title Master Sommelier in North America. Of the North American Master Sommeliers, 66 are men and 13 are women. There are a total of 124 Master Sommeliers worldwide.

That is very very very very special indeed. Way to go, Alpana.

I have heard from a wannabe sommelier how difficult it is to be a somelier, leave alone a master sommelier.

Sounds like someone needs to organize a Task Force outing, and soon.

and then you come home and sit down for Indian prayer and learn how to cook and clean, how to be a proper bride.

Alpana is quoted having said the above. Isn't this too much stereotyping.

The guy who probably looks not at you but the wine you drink is surely someone to avoid. And am sure most guys are sensible enough to enjoy the company of person than make conclusions based on what drink she orders.

Technophobicgeek #15 & #27, and several others:

While I agree that there's nothing wrong with ordering a diet coke -- there are lots of reasons why someone would not want alcohol after all -- I think your criticism is a little overboard. She's referring to people who've already made the decision to eat at the fancy restaurant, and once you're there, there are ways in which one might not fit in. Put it this way -- there's nothing at all wrong with liking fast food or simple comfort food or cheap beer, but there is something "wrong" with going to a five-star restaurant and asking the chef to make you a hot dog and ordering a bud light. There is admittedly a fine line between snobbery and just good etiquette and fitting in to whatever social situation one finds oneself in, but I view the latter as a positive trait in a person. The same goes the other way, by the way -- one does not go to a dive bar with a group of people and look for an expensive bordeaux or a martini.

And I think some of you are taking this book way too seriously. There's obviously a market for these types of books, just as there was all things related to Sex and the City (which itself fueled demand for fancy cocktails). She's catering to a particular audience, and I bet there are lots of women in that audience who are beginning to drink wine and who could use some wine appreciation tips (in addition to, apparently, relationship advice).

musical: And what does Alpana have to say about people who don't drink or ar not connoisseurs of fine wines, are they unsophisticated idiots !!

Actually, yes. To understand Hafez, Ghalib or Shelley, one needs to be rather familiar with wine. To understand wine, one needs to be rather familiar with poetry and music. Ergo, they all go together in making a refined person.
Haye Kambakht tune pii hi nahin.

..and I sniff, keep my chin up and go away to drink the ghastly Peet's coffee in the company's breakroom.

Manju [..]have drank a lot of wine in my time, but i still can't taste the differences in any meaningful way. so i don't bother with expensive wine anymore[..]

A wine instructor once told me that one has to train oneself on tasting and smelling wine by going to the grocery store smelling fruits and flowers and trying to "memorise" the smells. Apparently, it takes months/years for one to do that and then be able to recall the smells and claim "Aha, blueberry, peach, a hint of almonds and a touch of e-coli filled cowdung."

"Aha, blueberry, peach, a hint of almonds and a touch of e-coli filled cowdung."

Well said!!!!

It's good that she does what she wants to do. but anyone who spends that much time on a frickin drink maybe samples a bit too much of their product. The Cornell Hotel School has a very popular course, wine tasting, which also happens to be the most failed course in the entire university. [link]

Put it this way -- there's nothing at all wrong with liking fast food or simple comfort food or cheap beer, but there is something "wrong" with going to a five-star restaurant and asking the chef to make you a hot dog and ordering a bud light.

The hot dog or hamburger will just cost ya $50 and will called something along the lines of the "kobi burger." I would prefer a nice sprite with my kobi burger.

Its sad that the wine market is saturated with just a few types of wine,I would love to see more of a range including Malbec or Carmenere and my personal fav a good Tannat! Its always a trek to find a place that stocks them. And koodos to the Chileans, thats some good wine they are creating.

I'm really into Fat Tire right now, Chimay is a close second)

Are you from Kansas? I was visting the fine town of Great Bend, Kansas not long ago and really liked my Fat Tire. I haven't found it anywhere else, even Kansas City or Topeka

Chimay is a close second

As far as Belgian brews go, I'm going to have to go with Duvel.

The hot dog or hamburger will just cost ya $50 and will called something along the lines of the "kobi burger." I would prefer a nice sprite with my kobi burger.

There's a whole other discussion about whether ultra-expensive restaurants ever make sense in terms of what you get for the money spent. I'm generally as happy at a good Thai restaurant with $10 entrees as I am pretty much anywhere. But if I do find myself eating at a fancy restaurant (e.g., law firm dinner tonight at Citronelle in DC), I'll make every attempt to fit in and won't be ordering a $5 bottle of Singha (or equivalent beer).

please tell me how many of you can really taste every little difference between wines (besides the obvious differences)

It's as obvious as the difference between a $500 suit and a $3,000 one, natch.

I think I have to agree and I'm surprised people make this about snobbery. It's really not. I don't know anything about beer. I know I like Killians & Sam Adams Octoberfest...no idea if they are popular. I know nothing about a whole load of stuff. It's the same concept. I wouldn't mind learning though.

Isn't it about the date or the friends? Meaning, if the friends or the date were interesting in themselves, it wouldn't matter if you had fancy wine or Diet Coke.

OK I'll elaborate. I absolutely love wine and drink it all the time. Everyone around me loves loves wine so I really don't know anyone who orders a diet coke when we go out for a wine jaunt. Honestly I love my friends but I keep the drinkers and non drinkers separate just as I keep the vegetarians and non vegetarians separate. It ends up being far more enjoyable an experience when people are are jiving with eachother. And it's not snobbery, it's practicality. I've hosted parties where the non drinkers will leave because everyone else is drinking and the vegetarians are scared to eat the vegetarian stuff because the non veg stuff is in the room. And I host vegetarian and non alcoholic parties as well. Hence my point about making or breaking it.

And what does Alpana have to say about people who don't drink or ar not connoisseurs of fine wines, are they unsophisticated idiots !!

What does it matter? She is talking about A. What does B have to do with it?

I agree. Shall we pencil in Nov 18 (~3 weeks from now) for the next NYC meetup?

Mr Libertarian I'm there...

As far as Belgian brews go

...people should check out Hop Leaf in Andersonville in Chicago. Awsome beer selection, great mussels, kick ass fries with dipping sauce, filling cheese plates. Just don't aske for a miller lite here, you'll probably get weird stares (I'm not a snob, I like my 40z too).

I was pleasantly surprised by the selection of beers at BevMo! here on the west coast.

But if I do find myself eating at a fancy restaurant (e.g., law firm dinner tonight at Citronelle in DC), I'll make every attempt to fit in and won't be ordering a $5 bottle of Singha (or equivalent beer).

My husband always orders the burger and a sprite during lawfirm lunches when he's interviewing ;) The kobi burger is his preferred choice at French 75. I love him for it! I just find it insanely adorable.

FYI I had to say this...Yellowtail makes an excellent line of inexpensive wines. I highly recommend them. And they make some of the best blends in that price range.

Its sad that the wine market is saturated with just a few types of wine,I would love to see more of a range including Malbec or Carmenere and my personal fav a good Tannat! Its always a trek to find a place that stocks them. And koodos to the Chileans, thats some good wine they are creating.

I'm with you. I love Malbecs and Argentinian wines are fantastic too. In fact I adore most of South American wines as much as Australian wines. If you like Chilean wines try Sena (read: Senya)which I believe it's developed thru Robert Mondavi. It's a Bordeaux blend of Cabernet & Merlot and something else I forget. If you like Melbac you will like that.

I'll make every attempt to fit in

why do you have to order an expensive wine if what you really want is the beer (or dare i say a coke?)

so I really don't know anyone who orders a diet coke when we go out for a wine jaunt

agreed, if you're going out for a night of drinking, then it would be weird to order a soda, ... but i guess what people are finding a problem with is the notion that you have to order wine with your dinner if you are at an upscale restaurant, why?

maybe you're there for the food? maybe, you don't feel like drinking that night (or don't drink)? maybe....

Singh cringes when she thinks about the drop-dead gorgeous woman ... who asked for a Diet Coke

I absolutely love wine

JOAT, sorry sorry, I hope you'll forgive me -- but something about this discussion makes it impossible for me to avoid linking to ANNA's favorite picture from the last NYC meetup.... ;)

but i guess what people are finding a problem with is the notion that you have to order wine with your dinner if you are at an upscale restaurant, why?

I think that people are assuming that she is saying that. I don't read it that way at all. If I had planned a night out and someone ordered a diet coke in the group I'd probably ask WTF as well. She isn't talking about exceptions. I know people that will get intimidated by the experience and go for the safe bet because they dont' want to be embarrassed. And it isn't about "expensive" wine, it's about just having knowledge about wine to play along.

I agree with you Rani... and not everyone is a foodie or into wines. They should feel free to order the blandest item on the menu and a glass of water if it suits there taste regardless of how upscale the restaurant is.

Are you from Kansas? I was visting the fine town of Great Bend, Kansas not long ago and really liked my Fat Tire. I haven't found it anywhere else, even Kansas City or Topeka

When I feel like being a cheap date it's Bud Light.

I think we need to find an Indian Brewmaster and have him/her write a book on how beer and dating can go togther. It could be called BadIndianGirl pours a Good Head: About Being a Woman, Pounding Beer and Playing Flip Cup

"Never say never. Some of the world's greatest wines are 65% to 100% merlot. If you've ever enjoyed a St. Emilion or a Pomerol, two major classes of Bordeaux that include the world's most expensive wine, Chateau Petrus, then you've enjoyed a merlot."

True that, Siddhartha. I think I had one really great merlot and then a string of bad ones. Have you ever tried gewurstemeiner (which I can't spell, but love anyway)? And I do remember liking bordeaux when I tried it. I think I'll definitely need to work on developing my palate.

Incidentally, how do you get those dot thingies next to the passage when you quote it? I can't seem to get that but everyone else has figured it out. I'm behind the times.

It's funny, even though wine is just one type of foodstuff, wine snobs are snobbier than all of the rest of the foodies put together.

Replace "diet coke" with a type of food in this sentence and you'll see what I mean:

Singh cringes when she thinks about the drop-dead gorgeous woman ... who asked for a Diet Coke

Would she have cringed if the sentence was aobut the woman who didn't order the escargo? Or who didn't order desert? Or who couldn't tell the difference between expensive and cheap saffron? Or who liked Hershey's as much as real chocolate?

I don't accept idea that wine knowledge is indicative of somebody's level of general sensual sophistication. It's just one kind of food product.

Ani said:

The hot dog or hamburger will just cost ya $50 and will called something along the lines of the "kobi burger."

The kobi burger is his preferred choice at French 75. I love him for it! I just find it insanely adorable.

Only in good ole Los Angeles can you find a "Kobi burger." Everywhere else its called a "Kobe burger" but in Los Angeles if you call it that you will get sued by the Lakers. ;)

I think I have to agree and I'm surprised people make this about snobbery. It's really not.

What does it matter? She is talking about A. What does B have to do with it?

JOAT, as a passion, wine-tasting is as good as any other, I really have no issues with that. I do not think it is snobbish in itself to like wines and appreciate their differences and qualities.

My main problem with the whole wine thing is that it is not treated just as a passion, or even as an expression of passion+financial ability. When a rich person owns a bunch of sports cars, people know (s)he is rich, but nobody assumes that (s)he is a better person/more refined etc then everyone else. Same for the $500 + $3000 suit: I see a successful, rich man who is passionate about suits and appearance, and certain styles of clothing, but little else, because it's still kinda superficial.

That's not the case with a lot of wine experts...with wine, somehow it's your taste in wine is supposed to reflect some deep inner thing about you, how refined you are, how good a person you are etc, a concept I find really absurd but is drummed into us all around. That is exactly where the line between passion and snobbery gets crossed all the time. If I don't like a wine which the local wine expert at a party claims is the best, and I can't suggest an equally or more expensive alternative, obviously I am an unrefined person who does not deserve to be in the group. That is plain f*cking BS.

I'd like to believe that Alpana is not one of these people I'm referring to, but the whole diet coke comment seems to suggest otherwise. Of course, that might be a quote out of context.

JOAT, sorry sorry, I hope you'll forgive me -- but something about this discussion makes it impossible for me to avoid linking to ANNA's favorite picture from the last NYC meetup.... ;)

Anna was the bomb. We weren't allowed to take in glass bottles or any alcohol so she had the incredible foresight to bring wine in a box. I even blogged it I was so excited about it. Smuggled wine tastes better than anything.

Incidentally, how do you get those dot thingies next to the passage when you quote it? I can't seem to get that but everyone else has figured it out. I'm behind the times.

You highlight the entire text you want to put in quotes and click on the " button on the top of this message box next to the Comments:

I think that people are assuming that she is saying that. I don't read it that way at all. If I had planned a night out and someone ordered a diet coke in the group I'd probably ask WTF as well

people aren't assuming ... its what she said; she cringed when she saw a woman on a date do that ...

again, you're using the example of a night out with a group of people where the intention is to drink; the only analogy to make there would be is if you cringed if someone in your group ordered a bud light ....

semidesimasala, highlight the text and click the first button after "Comments:" or enclose your text with '

'

Anyone ever try that Omar Khyam 'champagne' stuff? Haunting memories of long-gone New Year's Eves in Bombay. Wine and India don't mix. All that shairi? Imported tropes. Ferghana, Herat -- you can lose yourself in bowls of grape, but once you get to the Deccan, things start to curdle. Alcohol is all about mood and climate. Pilsener (Primus) in the Congo, Guiness in West Africa, Arak in the Levant, brandy in the Caucasus and I guess, as per Scarlett and Bill, Suntory in Japan. The Muree stuff is all right (but too sweet), Kingfisher is better, but pegs of JW downed with everyone's favourite Sardee uncle are the way to go.

This right here

Never say never. Some of the world's greatest wines are 65% to 100% merlot. If you've ever enjoyed a St. Emilion or a Pomerol, two major classes of Bordeaux that include the world's most expensive wine, Chateau Petrus, then you've enjoyed a merlot.

My method of pouring a date a glass of two-buck-chuck from Trader Joe's hasn't been working all that well. I may need to buy this book.

Yellowtail makes an excellent line of inexpensive wines.

Go Aussie wines...

Also found some New Zealand wines at a Trader Joe's...apparently NZ has the best sauvignon blanc...

Wine and India don't mix.

Some gyanis agree w/ you.
Madhur Jaffrey said the same thing on Ming Tsai show. He looked quite confused.

I am curious about everyone's take on desi food - wine pairings.

There's a whole other discussion about whether ultra-expensive restaurants ever make sense in terms of what you get for the money spent. I'm generally as happy at a good Thai restaurant with $10 entrees as I am pretty much anywhere. But if I do find myself eating at a fancy restaurant (e.g., law firm dinner tonight at Citronelle in DC), I'll make every attempt to fit in and won't be ordering a $5 bottle of Singha (or equivalent beer).

so i was in brea a month back and it's a pretty posh spot even for california. i had dinner one night at this fancy italian spot - some simple pasta dish - the waiter's buzzing around with the giant apron and that disturbing phallic grinder... ho-hum - the next day me's depressed because brea is so soulless - so i go walking - ittle mall - chinese resto - korean owner - matron greets me - about to close down - but no probs - come on in - cook comes out - chinese dude - vegetarian - no problem - no fried stuff - no problem - basically flash boiled stuff in front of me - whipped up sauce -tres delicious - now that was Soul - mater came down to chat. told me about her vancouver trip. we gabbed. i left - they shut down the lights.

all my best restaurant experiences are like that - it goes beyond teh food and the price point - one is comfortable and feels at peace - leave the pressure out of te door - and the best resto's know how to do that. btw - if you've read teh bio of the cook (whose name escapes me) a resto is one of the most challenging and stimulating jobs out there - part performance, part art, part gruntwork and all passion - give it your all and turn off the switch when you walk out - and it shows when you walk in the door - and that's where i make the call - a gut check - no soul, no go.

I gotta chime in with techno, chickpea, Mam, etc..--I am super skeptical, and that diet-cola story is a huge turn-off. I'm all for enjoying and articulating your experiences in life, and if wine is your thing, and you're not self-destructive about it, fine----good writing on sensual topics is always appreciated. But people seem to increasingly confuse well-developed sensuality with heart and character. A taste-profile is not a substitute for a personality, and in the end a finely tuned-palate matters very little. When people make such grand, lyrical claims connecting things like love with a multi-billion dollar industry, it shuts off my ability to enjoy either their point of view or their product, and greatly amplifies things like my discomfort with the environmental and economic impact. So I guess I'm ironically grateful to Alpana--less likely to want to try any expensive wine now!

DTK--2 points. 1) I'm kind of against conflation. Why conflate a fancy dress, a nice restaurant, and expensive wine? Sure diet coke might not have gone with the food at hand--but that doesn't mean the only alternative is wine. Water is always classy. Mix and match! Things you associate with each other don't always logically imply each other--they've just been associated with each other by tradition and time. The last black-tie party I was at, wearing one of the fanciest dresses I've worn, was in an apartment with vegan desserts and middling expensive wine. (I had lemonade.) It was a blast. I've been to receptions in incredibly fancy digs where you would have looked out of place in anything less casual than jeans.

2) It's true that this is a type of book catering to a particular demand, but the side-effects of this transaction impact all of us, and it's a demand which is fundamentally grounded in status, opinion, fashion, marketing, and the relentless tapping of our associative brains. Industries don't spend billions of dollars filling the atmosphere with the idea that a bottle of two-buck chuck can make for a perfectly good date. Attractive people get paid a lot of money to attractively say things in a way that will make the rest of us want to buy something. There's nothing necessarily wrong with that, but I think it's important for people to pipe up when they have any devil's advocate comments to add to the conversation, b/c on the balance they aren't going to be heard most of the time.

BadIndianGirl - You have good taste :) Try Red Stripe sometime.

Did y'all ever have desi - Golconda Wine? Quite a kick.IMO - The only wine that really goes with spicy Indian food. It cost about 5 bucks a bottle I think.

Wine and India don't mix

Says you. Merlot goes awesomely with Indian meat dishes especially goat curry.

I am curious about everyone's take on desi food - wine pairings.

BadIndianGirl - You have good taste :)

I think DTK got it right in saying it's something like asking if they serve hot dogs and fries if your date takes you to a 3-star Michelin restaurant.

And Singh's original comment about the woman ordering a Diet Coke -- to be honest, I don't think it's about her thinking that someone HAS to drink wine or liquor. Order a San Pellegrino or even just plain water and you'll look just fine. Sorry, maybe it's the snob in me, but I think it just seems trashy to order soda in a fine dining establishment -- maybe it's just the fact that so many people drink Coke with everything that they think it'll be good with their lobster as well. Hm, I guess if you like Coke, go ahead and have it. If it makes you happy to eat with your fingers, go ahead and do that as well and who cares what the sommelier thinks. I think Singh's point may just be that there's a way to learn to enjoy and be comfortable with food and wine if you're curious about it -- whether it's a $5 glass of Yellowtail or a $490 Champagne.

Why thank you Beige Seige, I'm blushing...

Hmm...A Bad Indian Girl who blushes? I am in love.

The only Indian wine I have ever had was homemade, illegally at that because it was at a family friend's house in Baroda...

I too had homemade Indian wine once. My uncle's grape farm (table top variety) used to make wine outta grapes that were not good enough to sell as fruit. So you can guess how the wine tasted ;)

JOAT:

Alpana is fabulous and very well known in wine connoisseur circles...OK I realize that sounded snooty but she's endearing because she's got a really warm personality unlike the general dry snobbery that accompanies people who love and know about wine and she very openly and willingly shares unlike the posers.

Did you think so? I remember dining at Everest a few years ago with a large party of people, and she struck me as being particlarly snooty. Just another datapoint.

abhi-- i totally support the two-buck-chuck. i still think of wine as the beverage of choice for high rollers.

'I am curious about everyone's take on desi food - wine pairings.'

I heard that gewurstemeiner goes well with indian food. the sweetness complements the complexity of spices. I tried it with sambar, and idlis and it was pretty good. also it's wine so the alcohol was fun. :)

Still can't get those dots...I'm typing on a mac at work, does that make a difference?

Why thank you Beige Seige, I'm blushing...

Hmm...A Bad Indian Girl who blushes? I am in love.

Well we can close the comments section now. Alpana's book has succeeded in doing what she wanted it to do, it has brought two people together over wine... HA!
And I'm not even wearing a really expensive dress ordering a diet coke, I'm just wearing my business casual slacking off from work.

I heard that gewurstemeiner goes well with indian food. the sweetness complements the complexity of spices. I tried it with sambar, and idlis and it was pretty good.

Merlot goes awesomely with Indian meat dishes

It also goes well with Goan sausage.

And this may be off topic, but I'm trying to find a way of making vegetarian Goan sausages. Anyone have any ideas? The main thing would be to get the correct blend of spices.

Well we can close the comments section now...And I'm not even wearing a really expensive dress ordering a diet coke, I'm just wearing my business casual slacking off from work.

If you had proceeded to ask Beige Seige what he was wearing then we would have to close the comments down.

Singh's comment is sample biased towards wine, and it's taste. Drinking wine to her is what owning a shotgun is to an Alabama redneck. They can't conceive of life without it, personally I think wine tastes like sh*t, as does all alcohol (think about the fermentation process, it's a conversion FROM glucose (sugar) into a more acidic substance, how in the world could it taste good? So being a wine expert is like knowing the difference between french southern green grape colored sh*t and northern california purple grape colored sh*t.

I say order whatever the (@#$ you want, whereever you want.

saheli, i completely agree. the part that bothers me about her statement is that it implies some kind of elevated status just cause one picks the correct wine. but i guess that's the thing that bothers me about most "fine dining establishment" - the fact that you have to do certain things and order certain things in order to be deemed fit enough to enjoy your meal. i've eaten many great dinners in new york, but i conciously try to stay away from the ones that are snooty, or where i detect an attitude like the one in alpana's statment. sometimes food tastes better with wine. sometimes you want a diet coke - neither will make or break your relationship.

She is a wine expert. Read and learn. The rest, well, isn't all that important. Knowing wine and knowing relationships are two different things. One is relatively simpler, and it isn't relationships for sure.

SM Intern,

Help me out with this dot thing. I don't see an extra button and I tried the apostrophe thing. I haven't tried on my pc yet, but I can't do it on a mac. help!

you have to do certain things and order certain things in order to be deemed fit enough to enjoy your meal

It's all a matter of a opinion and what one finds "proper" or fitting, I guess, but seriously, if you took a date to a swanky restaurant and she did any of the following...
a) consistently chewed with her mouth open
b) waved her fork in the air to punctuate her conversation
c) ordered a tall glass of milk with her lamb chops

... would you not make the same kind of comment made about the woman ordering a diet coke along with her date's $490 champagne? It's all a matter of degree, eh?

Living in San Francisco, you meet a lot of self appointed Wine/Foodie people. They gush about this restuarant or that or seasonal product (which I kind of have to agree with, because CA has the BEST fresh produce)blah, blah, blah...

At the end of the day, I'm eating the food I like to eat and not feeling inferior for loving Nizario's pizza at 2 am.

It's all relative. I can tell what bad wine is, but the medium range and up is all the same to me. But I know good karela shak when I taste it, it's all about the ghor...

Alpana's book is for the above mentioned Wine/Foodie peeps that abound in SF because that is what is important to them. What's important to me is what beer should I drink when it's raining because it's bujia (pakora) and beer weather (according to my cousin).

Help me out with this dot thing.

Please see our FAQ. All the help you need will probably be there. If not use this link to contact us.

I heard that gewurstemeiner goes well with indian food. the sweetness complements the complexity of spices. I tried it with sambar, and idlis and it was pretty good.

Second this. It's a great pairing, in my experience.

Hmm. Gewurztraminer is a bit of an acquired taste and sometimes can be a little over the top. I'd serve it with some Indian dishes but as a failsafe, I'd rather go with an Alsace riesling or pinot blanc. Alsace is key for the riesling as most German rieslings and pretty much every American one will be too sweet. Another white varietal that goes reasonably well with desi food is viognier, which produces some expensive (and very good) white Cotes-du-Rhone, and some OK cheapie wines from Languedoc. Another way to go is whites from Northwest Spain - from the albarino and other grapes - lots of interesting stuff all the way from the Basque country to Galicia.

Similarly there are quite a few red options. As with anything else, the perfect pairing depends on what you are serving - I'd serve a different wine with a lamb biryani than I would with a veg curry. Having aid all that, one rule of thumb I always follow is that when the chilies get above a certain level of heat, you gotta go with beer all the way.

Go Aussie wines...

Deaking Estate makes some good cabernet...that is not all fruit but has layers with some tobacco. Their 2003 Cabernet was pretty good at about $10 a bottle.

I think bits of the Chicago Reader article debunk her snobbery just a little, e.g.:

"It’s totally fine to drink cheap, cute-animal-branded Australian Shiraz, she says, and if you like your wine so cold you can’t taste it, well, then that’s what you like."

"...when asked about the importance of a wine’s price, she says, 'Well, the cheaper it is, the more likely I am to buy it.'"

the chilies get above a certain level of heat, you gotta go with beer all the way.

Yeah, an Asahi can from Arco and a couple of papads (nuked 5.30 minutes on a kitchen towel) after a long day ....

..

I am curious about everyone's take on desi food - wine pairings.

I think Gerwurztraminer, Reisling, Pinot Noir, Pinot Grigio, some Zinfandel all go well with Indian food. But, that's just me.

I understand wine snobs. I'm a sushi snob. It's a curse and an addiction. You’re compelled to spend huge amounts of money to taste what is, to others, simply inconsequential. You sense things that others don't and wonder why. You can't help but think they’re inferior and don't want to associate with them. It's like you're listening to a symphony and they're hearing Brittney Spears.

It's snobbery. But it's real, not affected or pretentious. I honestly loathe you simpletons.

If the article was written about Manju ;)

Manju cringes when s/he thinks about the drop-dead gorgeous woman ... who asked for a California Roll