July 11, 2007
Fighting Green Card Injustice With Green KindnessNews
Many of you commented or left news tips about the plan to give flowers to USCIS director Emilio Gonzalez, as a form of peaceful protest against the ridiculously unfair green card debacle. Approximately two hundred bouquets were sent. WaPo covers Gandhigiri:
They did it because that’s what Gandhi would have done.
Yesterday, their bouquets of purple roses, pink lilies and yellow daisies, which cost about $40 each and which were sent from all over the country, piled up on the immigration office’s loading dock at 20 Massachusetts Ave. NW, addressed to Gonzalez and stacked in columns taller than people.
The agency forwarded them to soldiers recovering at Walter Reed Army Medical Center.
“We know the reason behind it and understand the symbolism. We donated them in the same spirit in which they were provided to us,” said an agency official who spoke on condition of anonymity because of a lawsuit over the matter filed by an advocacy group.
Background, for any who missed it:
Green card applicants were given hope on June 12, when the State Department posted a bulletin offering H1B visa holders who had been stuck in a bureaucratic logjam an opportunity to take that last step needed to apply for permanent residency.
Thousands of engineers, doctors and other educated foreigners began a mad scramble to file their applications before the July 2 deadline.
Vacations were canceled, and lawyers were called in. Elderly parents in far-flung corners of the world stood in line for hours to get copies of birth certificates and immunization records.
Then, on the day of the deadline, the State Department retracted the bulletin. The USCIS, which processes the applications, said it had already met its 140,000-person annual quota for employee-sponsored applicants.
The most infuriating aspect of it all— people who are here illegally are now standing in the same virtual line for a limited and precious commodity. I can totally understand the pain; you do the right thing, follow the rules and then someone cuts in front of you— and you’re S.O.L. It happened when I tried to buy Pixies tickets a few years ago and that stung. I can’t imagine the anguish over this, which is 100x more important.
“Only someone with the saddest mind can do this,” said Ashish Mundada, 31, an information technology consultant who works in New York City. Mundada had persuaded his wife to cancel a trip back to India for a sister’s wedding to take advantage of what seemed like a brief window of opportunity. Mundada, like many other protesters, said he did not want any favors, just that his application be fairly considered.
Such beautiful kindness and grace:
They do not hold hard feelings against Gonzalez. “I’d like to thank him for the job that he does. I know it’s a thankless job,” Tekkedil said. “I just hope that he could understand our plight as well.”
Such sadness and anxiety:
Their uncertain status makes them fearful of notice. Anand Sharma, 35, a chip design engineer from Longmont, Colo., said she drives well under the speed limit on highways. “We are so scared. We just want to stay here.”
But they are weary of how their lives have been frozen in time. They must retain the same job title and income they had when they began the application process, which can last for eight years.
I don’t mind if the flowers achieve the goal, but I hope something does. This isn’t right.
anna on July 11, 2007 01:20 PM in News · T·r·a·c·k·b·a·c·k address · Direct link · Email post
The flowers got the issue some attention, hope it continues to catch some more attention at the national level.
And Oh! please send some flowers to Lou Dobbs also.
My roommate's girlfiend (ok, whether she's his "girlfriend" yet is a topic for another thread :-) is an immigration lawyer. She was saying that Gonzo apparently sent the flowers to Walter Reed. Great! Now we're enabling him to look good too! :) And she was also saying that the belief is that this was probably deliberately done by State to make the USCIS look bad.
As for the snafu itself, apparently USCIS has been sitting on these limbo applications that were submitted during the frenzy, many of which have original documents associated with them. Hopefully some decision will be reached on them by September when the window for the next application opens.
So, who is the first desi going to be arrested after giving him a jadoo ki jhappi? Or maybe you think jadoo means broom? That's fine by me too.
"They must retain the same job title and income they had when they began the application process, which can last for eight years."
OMG. I had no idea that the job title and income must remain constant ... this is so unfair! I'm not even out of grad school yet, and have a while before I get to the green card stage, but just the thought of the bleak years to come is so incredibly depressing.
Thank you ANNA for your post.
While the USCIS/DOS vias bulletin fiasco is a perfect example of the lack of communication between two big federal govt agencies, the underlying problem dates back to years. All the immigrant visa numbers for any given fiscal year (oct-sep) cannot be carried forward to the next year. USCIS/DOL has wasted approximately 220,000 such visa numbers and created these huge backlogs. The visa numbers were supposed to go wasted if there were no one waiting in line, not if people were waiting in line. Congress needs to intervene and allow for the recapture of visa numbers from previous years (it has done in the past) and allow the numbers to be carried forward for one year as it will give some leeway to agencies like USCIS/DOL/DOS.
Please no!! Have some pity on the flowers shall we?
Maybe we can send Michael Moore over, he can surely give Dobbs a jaadoo ki jhappi.
Sounds pretty ridiculous.
Not correct. The job functions have to be similar area (your responsibilities though can increase). Salary can be any amount not less than the prevailing minimum wage in that area.
Guys ... ghandigiri gave independence after fasting for so many years (50 years... mostly). i think we are not permitted that many years to stay here and fight by doing this kind of activities on H1.
phool bhejo ..... biwi marega (as she did not those for any occasion). Doing these activities and concentrate else were ..... project not completed... Boss gand marega ....
Ajar green card time pe nahin tho ..... hamara gand podega.....
sala gand tho Atlantic ocean banjeyaga......
hmmm...brown people fighting against a white government using people with green hands as intermediaries...hmm....
But it doesn't happen in practical life. The employer knows that you are not going anywhere as long as your green card is not done (or at least you are at the fag end of the process with EAD for atleast 6 months). So they don't have to increase the wages to remain an attractive employer in a good economy when there are so many options.
Also its improbable (not impossible) to break into management with H1b as they like some stability with their management , whereas technical resources are replaceable.
This story really touched my heart, I'm so moved that they sent flowers as a means to protest. It's nice to see Gandhian philosophy at work in the U.S.
Thanks for sharing Anna!
#13 "But it doesn't happen in practical life. The employer knows that you are not going anywhere as long as your green card is not done"
This is total BS. Please don't spread misinformation about GC based on hearsay. I actually quit the firm that applied for my GC years before I got my GC. Firm A pays for all legal costs (some $8000) towards GC. Once application is filed, you can quit A. I did. No harm done. You can do whatever afterwards - go to India, be jobless in USA, have a ball, vacation, whatever. Once your GC application is approved, at that point ie. right before the actual GC-interview, you must be employed in some firm B in similar area of expertise. They enforce that by asking for & making xerox of your latest paystub from B. Nobody gives fuck about A. The loser here is A. A hoped you will stick around, that's why A paid legal for your GC. But hey, A also thinks it has you in a bind, so they don't bother to hike your wages. So you turn around & fuck A. In my case, I fucked both A and B. I joined B just to get that fucking paystub, and quit 1 MINUTE after getting GC. Honest to God. I called B's boss & said, look dear, I got my GC so fuck you, I quit. He was a pal, told me he knew I would always do that. I don't recommend fucking B ( unless its run by your friend who won't rat on you ) but you must certainly fuck A if they are dicking with your wages.
All talk of f***ing aside (Tambram, I missed you on the threads!), there is additional trouble that might accrue from changing jobs, although it varies from person to person. I've had people who got laid off from "A", were employed later by "B", and were called for in-person interviews as a result. Of course, there were other people who never found a "B" to f***, and were sitting at home when the green card showed up.
Tambaram,
To get into the specifics of what you are talking, people need to have two things to move from employer to employer and still retain their priority date
a) approved I 140 and I 485 pending with USCIS for more than 180 days
b) approved I 140 and then move to a different employer who can offer a job with same description
It is easy for people in situation (a) and not in (b) because of AC21. For people in (b), they have to find a job that it is of similar description. May be you got hired by your pal to do so. Not every one gets a chance like you. I dont know how long before you have done this, but the truth is EB2/EB3 for India have been retrogressed from the past 2/3 years. There were cases in the past in big corporates where people were denied raises because that would be in violation with the LCA and stuff. Don't generalize based on your situation and every one does not have the nerves to take a chance as simple mistakes can put them back at the end of the serpentine GC queues.
Green Card injustice? F**** the US and go back to India. Why would you want to live in the US? It's time to be arrogant and say we're better and smarter than the white guys. We don't need to immigrate.
Not all companies do sponsor all/some of the GC related expenses. The INS regulations require employers to pay the H1B fee but not the GC fee. It depends on the relation ship of the employer and employee. Too many f'isms. Probably employer C is acting up now :)
Tambram, both your corporate life and your home life seem far more exciting than us mere mortals.
Don't hate the playa, hate the game! :)
I wonder how much of this is actually Gandhian philosophy and how much is element of a dumbass movie that had it's elements but would never win a quality cinematic award.
Sure there are elements of non violence here and also turning the other cheek but Gandhi was wiser than that, his political methods did not just stop there, there was a lot more to it. His whole campaign was based on civil disobedience where you make the other party realize that they are indeed dependent to some extent on you by not playing to their whims and fancies. Here, if these GC hopefuls all went on something akin to a strike and did it in large numbers, now that would work. Sending flowers is a good for newsworthiness but I doubt it has any more use than that.
Thanks for saying this! Gonzo is no Boman Irani, and Secretary of State Condi Rice is certainly no Vidya Balan. Although Dan Quayle would've made a great Circuit.
Correction on the typos, got a little too elementary -
I wonder how much of this is actually Gandhian philosophy and how much is the influence of a dumbass movie that had it's moments but would never win a quality cinematic award.
I'm all for paying tribute to Gandhi and peaceful protests, but honestly. We might as well offer to do USCIS' taxes and send them homemade brownies as well. WTF?
Who knows, some proud Indian citizen in Bangalore might already be doing them?
Pun intended? Maybe brownie cheesecakes?
#17 - Don't generalize based on your situation and every one does not have the nerves
Sir, I am being very specific, no generalization at all. I did it. I had the nerves so I did it. If you have nerves you also do it. If no nerves then don't. But the parent post said "it doesn't happen in real life", so I called BS because I actually did it so I know it can very well be done.
#15 Rahul "there were other people who never found a "B" to f***, and were sitting at home when the green card showed up".
Dai Rahul I was that exact person la. I was sitting at home & got the approval notice. btw your green card itself doesn't show up. You get an approval notice in mail, it gives you enough time ( atleast 2 weeks ) to present yourself before immig officer to claim your gc. In that 2 weeks, if you are a fob with the usual connections, you can move mountains. I called a pal running his chota calif startup, asked him to put me on his payroll retrogressively 3 months so no suspicion aroused by immig, "paid" my wages for those 3 months to him, he then "paid" them back to me via legal paystub, which I then took to the interview. I was in and out of the interview in less than 5 minutes. I thought I will meet with well-dressed immig officer, so I actually rented one tuxedo. My immig turned out to be an obese black woman with double chin. She was dressed quite shabbily and honestly at that moment I thought she was a minimum wage person. She was sitting behind desk full of papers exactly like a Govt of India office. I walk in, she takes out my folder, looks at me, matches my face with photo in folder, gives me GC, says "Welcome to USA". I said ok. I could have been more verbose but I was actually quite shocked at the brevity and ridiculousness of the whole exercise. I thought she will do formal interview or atleast ask me something about myself, what do I do etc. But no. She gives card, says welcome to USA. So I also said ok & then left with my card. Immediately I quit B & that was that.
Shhhh!! Dobbs may be listening, his ears are built into the fabric of space time itself, for gods sake.
Even when he's out and about building a fence from sea to shining sea? I hope I get into a situation (room) with the Wolf so I fulfil my lifetime ambition of going, "Who let the Dobbs out? Woof, woof, woof, woof!"
What does this dumb and sappy move have to do with Gandhi? Gandhi struck hard at the economic arteries of the British Raj. He was a total pain in the ass, hated by conservatives, lampooned in the right wing press. His actions cost mill workers in England their jobs, among other things. He wasn't a silly, sentimental, purposeless creature as this flower-gesture would imply. If they want to make a real point, why don't these H1B visa dudes conduct a fast unto the death at the Lincoln Memorial or something? Now that might be real gandhigiri.
Their employers will fire them, their H1Bs will become invalid, and they will have to leave the country within 30 days.
They wont fire them if the whole campaign gains lot of support and momentum. Companies would also want you to be happy and would help you out in a scenario like this.
LMAO at Who let the Dobbs out.
I sometimes seriously wonder WTF do some of me DBD bros get so desperate about to live here that they take all kinds of shite for it. Ok, I guess some have valid reasons to need to be there but a lot of the others can be just as comfortable and happy in the desh. I mean, they should put things in perspective, if living here is too much hassle get the heck back to India. Things are pretty awesome there. Ok, you have a cushy job here and all that jazz and if things are not so bad, do your thing. But when it becomes such a pain that your friggin life revolves around how to stick around one more day, I think it's just not worth it.
Ardy,
For a lot of people this is their first brush with real independence and a lot of people invest upwards of five years in this process, to give everything up after working hard for it is not really an option. I am sure many people go back on their own accord but forced out of the country is not the same thing is it?
Ardy:
What about hundreds of ppl like me..who have our undergraduate and graduate degrees from here. Lived here LEGALLY from anywhere from 8 years to 15 years on a number of different visa categories. Have kids who are US citizens..have suburban homes and weber grillS too.
SHOULD WE GO BACK TOO?
Brown - I meant why be so desperate for a GC in the first place. Why even have the attitude 'I have to settle down here'. Before coming here, people were fine in India and once we go back, we'll be fine again - if anything things have got so much better.I am not sure what you meant by independence. I agree that women do have more freedom here and I can appreciate their desire to settle here. But I see a lot of men not ok with the idea of returning too.
maybe they are in a career that pays far more in the US than in india....
In all seriousness though, many people say that find it "hard to adjust" to a typical Indian workplace, as offices are not that "professional." I haven't worked in India, except for an internship, so I don't feel qualified to argue either way. Some are also scared about going back and setting up a home in India all over again (Suketu Mehta describes this in Maximum City: getting your kids into school, begging the municipality to give you water and electricity connections etc). While I can imagine this initial phase is a bit of an ordeal, most things are fairly easily accomplished by greasing palms, left, right, and center (I am not endorsing/condoning this, of course, merely observing it). People probably take all this into consideration when they weigh that against the perpetual stress of waiting for a green card.
my dad doesnt want to go back, because he left india due to being morally opposed to greasing palms...
By independence I meant independence for both men and women. The attraction for guys is that a lot of them live at home with their parents in India and coming to America and experiencing life on their own with no parental influence is a motivation, the degree varies for people but in my personal experience a lot of guys enjoy it as much as the girls.
I am not disputing the desparation bit, I came here 6 years back and my work visa gets over in 2010, I don't think I will be applying for my GC as for me personally it is not worth the wait, I am happy to go back but am here till 2010 for the extra money.
That is a very common misconception. If you think in terms of PPP or quality of life, people actually get paid more there. This is definitely true for engineers and MBAs, and some higher degrees. Not lawyers and doctors. A single income family can live a lot more comfortably there than here.
Another reason given is usually the quality of work is better here but again, that was true in the past. With top rung management consultants doing a lot of strategy and finance work there and lot of high end engineering (definitely for EE. CS and some other fields which make the bulk of DBD engineers here anyways), that too is not true.
Oh yeah, I forgot to mention all the people here who work in fields that are probably not lucrative/respectable/under-funded in India (say you work in very specific sort of lab, or your life-goal is to translate Gramsci into English :)). Lots of individuals may (rightly) be willing to tolerate lot of strain to preserve their professional ambition.
im not sure if people are thinking entirely of PPP. i think a lot of people start by saying. i can save a lot of dough in the US. they multiply their savings by 50 mentally, and feel really happey. then years become decades, then they feel at home here. become the T+1 immigrant. the guy that says he will go back "next year" for like 40 years straight.
Portmanteau - I think you have a good point. My own concern so far has been the atrocious work culture I see my friends work in, it is BAD!! Regarding public services, I guess you are right that people are probably wary of going back and hacing to deal with that (though if you have the green bucks or use the RTI Act, you can get away with a lot less hassle).
Brown - the independence of guys thing could be true but could easily be fixed if one just gets a job in a different city. I guess my family was always cool in most things and so I did not think of that aspect.
Puliogre,
You can never be sure of why the person is not able to go back for 40 years, probably becuase he or she has kids who are born and raised here and uprooting them will not be sensible and many other such factors. I don't think it is right to cast judgments till you know the whole story.
Ardy,
I understand what you are saying, I haven't been living at home since I was 21 so that was not a pull for me either. You will be surprised to know how many guys are in a situation where this is their first brush with independence.
#43 Neale, my bad, she was a hot lily-white lady with flaming blond tresses in a teeny miniskirt, cumpleat Heidi Klum clone, and we fucked right there on that table on top of all those green green cards. Happy now ? My fellow DBDs, if you have gotten your green cards in the past year and you noticed some white stains on the green, that was probably our doing so pliss to forgive. Dai Neale, I'm trying to relate my GC incident as accurately as possible. She was black, she was obese, she had two chins, she was shabbily dressed. I remember it very vividly so I wrote it. If you have a problem take it up with her. immig officers probably meet 100 people everyday, you expect they will appoint somebody groomed and dressed a lot more professional in that highly public position. she just didn't look the part.
28 Sir, I am being very specific, no generalization at all. I did it. I had the nerves so I did it. If you have nerves you also do it. If no nerves then don't. But the parent post said "it doesn't happen in real life", so I called BS because I actually did it so I know it can very well be done.
Thanks for the clarification with regards to being specific and not generalizing. As I said, not all people have similar conducive situations like you and the nerve to do it comes later. Some people do not want to take risks and as far as I am concerned, its my situation and not any thing else, like you thought. May be your statement should have been " If people have the nerves they will do it "
Neale - it's not perfect there too. It's a tradeoff, one has to put it in perspective is all I am saying. But when life does become hell here due to say immigration woes, interrupted electricity may be a better alternative but a lot of people don't even consider the option. Goins back is not even an alternative considered, its blasphemy.
From someone who has been through the process, it boils down to $$$ and an easy way out of competition for everything. Not sure how many of the commenters have applied for admissions to colleges/jobs in India over the past ten years. It is cut-throat. If one can make it out here, lifestyle is peaceful, you actually have a personal life and money in the bank. Yes, you can save in India but from personal experience not as much. I have worked in Desh for 5 yrs before I moved here. Not much is different with the work culture but I find quality of life here that I don't find back home. I miss the people but you win some, you lose some. I did wait six yrs to get my GC, I can empathize with the anxiety, the frustration that people who sent flowers to USCIS face. It is like being between the devil and deep sea. It all evens out in the end.
Here is the thing, at least something was done! these SOBs can just go on and do what they want, thats BS. The media should latch onto this.
Tambram - you rented a tuxedo to meet with an immigration officer?
In my torturous dealings over the last few years with Indian officials, I have always found that the best-dressed males in positions of authority were the least helpful, competent or accountable individuals. They invariably pass the buck, think themselves too uppity to perform the least service for you, have tea served to them constantly, take frequent breaks, lack any customer service skills or simple diplomacy, and frankly, exhibit a mental lethargy and vacancy that astounds me.
If you can't treat black people/women/people who aren't dressed as well as you as equals, then please go back to India. At least you know that the incompetent well-dressed men serving you will be, in your estimation, worthy of you and your silly tuxedo.
We can rant and rave about the good things in US and bad things in India and vice versa. Bottom line, It comes to the individual who makes the decision. I have seen people who uprooted the whole family and replanted them selves in India. How ever most of the people chose to stay in the US for a multitude of reasons. There are good things in both countries and any one has to pick one. What matters to the individual/family most influences his/her/their decision.
Why want to come to the US?
One thing I think of about India though is that it is so polluted and therefore you have the opportunity to lead a healthier life here.
One way to answer the question, "why want to come to the US" is why did our parents want to come? For my father it was opportunity and a ton of a lot more money w/o the corruption.
If you can't treat black people/women/people who aren't dressed as well as you as equals, then please go back to India.
Why don't they go back now? They have beautiful property there and I think they sometimes consider going back. But I've heard my mom say, that she just couldn't deal with all the corruption and the trouble it takes to do something simple and it's too hot.
Well, I don't think Tambram explicitly said that...but something about the tone of his comment, made me think the same thing.
Tambram, re: your response to Neale. Wow - you're a work of art. A potential poster child for the anti-immigrant movement. There's this funny thing about the States, my friend. People worry more about whether a person can do a job, not if they have two chins.
Sorry my post is messed up - I hope this makes it more clear:
Why want to come to the US?
One thing I think of about India though is that it is so polluted and therefore you have the opportunity to lead a healthier life here.
One way to answer the question, "why want to come to the US" is why did our parents want to come? For my father it was opportunity and a ton of a lot more money w/o the corruption.
Why don't they go back now? They have beautiful property there and I think they sometimes consider going back. But I've heard my mom say, that she just couldn't deal with all the corruption and the trouble it takes to do something simple and it's too hot.
If you can't treat black people/women/people who aren't dressed as well as you as equals, then please go back to India.
Well, I don't think Tambram explicitly said that...but something about the tone of his comment, made me think the same thing.
Yes. People like you did shady things to get Immigration benefits. People following the rules got shafted because of guys like you. Great! You are suited well to greasing palms, connections culture of India. You should have stayed there. Hope you get royally screwed not by
but by in the near future.Tambram.
Thanks for calling my BS. Now I know all of us who follow the law are idiots and you are the smartest one, who plays the system!
Some of the people who filed for labor are stuck in it for years and they cant go anywhere else unless they are ready to start again with the new priority date, which basically means leaving your spot and going at the end of the queue. There are a few more valid points to counter your argument,but I am loath to give it you because afterall you know how to curse and when you have such a gift then who needs facts and logic and arguments!
I envy you! and thats my last word to you on this.
Tambram,
This Tambram handle - does it mean anything? Just asking.
Now everyone knows Tambram did not do everything as the USCIS would want him to do. But I still think immigrating to US was his right and he got it. Its like stealing from a thief. Neither the system nor Tambram is perfect.
I remember way back when I held a green card, it said "Legal Alien" on the top in big blue letters. Is this still the case?
#59, Ha ha ha you crack me up! junta is completely vela.
thank god i got my green card, i thought i have the freedom to write i met 1 black person today if i did in fact meet 1 black person. Back in desh, if I met a dark lady who looks like Tun Tun, I will have to say, I have just met Aishwarya Rai! Otherwise they will lynch me. Here in USA atleast I thought I can be honest. No more. Ok I will do complete rewrite. My immig, she was a hot black woman with no chin, like that Halli Barry. No no let me play it totally safe. Ok here goes. She was a colorless woman, totally transparent, like one big block of ice. Because I don't see color. Infact I don't even see sex. So I'm not sure if it was a she or a he. It. Yes, that is right. My immig, It was a machine like the ATM machine. It was a black machine but it had one white button. I pushed that white button and it gave me one green card. I marvelled at the colorful American Technology and fell at its feet. It blessed me with numerous human children red yellow blue violet purple. They are running amuck in my pink kitchen bathing in my orange juice and playing catch with my green pepper. Happy ?
I suspect it is either Tamil Brahman or the place Tambaram in Madras.
You know what they say, bess. Once you go south... you're too darn close to the Mexico border.
Since the thread deals with GC and going back to India - Lets say you are well educated Indian male, have got a good job and working in USA. Now this being a modern era/generation you probably don't want to marry a homemaker/housewife like your mother/grandmother was and moreover Indian females, being the new age/liberated woman, doesn't want to be a homemaker. Now if that couple decide to go back to India how easy it is for both of them to get a satisfying job in the same city in India ?
( maybe SM should blog about the two-body problem (i.e long distance relationship) in US and also in India amongst desi couples in this new age )
Flowers are silly -- better to send some hijras to tempt Gonzalez.. Loosen him up with some fine Desi weed first....
There are a few considerations here. If the wifey is someone who came from India post marriage and has a good degree by Indian standards and the dude does not have the GC, she probably has a much much better chance of finding a good job in India. If the guy has a green card and the wife has a good degree (i.e. a professional job oriented degree, we are not thinking fine arts or social sciences), I would rate the chances more or less equal. 3rd case, the liberated woman has a background similar to the guy, again if the dude can find a job the lady can too.
Interestingly, no one has yet brought up the topic of returning because you want to add to the Indian growth, economy or something along the lines of nationalism for the place where one grew up.
share the wealth!
"Interestingly, no one has yet brought up the topic of returning because you want to add to the Indian growth, economy or something along the lines of nationalism for the place where one grew up."
As far as desis my age(20-25) are concerned, patriotism has been noticeably on the low... and materialism has been on an amazing high. Add to that the glorification of the west, and everyone is just waiting for their chance to leave. Frustration among the youth in India ranges from the corruption of the system to the conservativeness of society... to probably the most important, the competition. To get a seat at an IIM, you need to be in the top 98-99 percentile in your CAT exams, otherwise you end up with an MBA at a B-school, that is, if you even want to take it.
At that point, one starts looking for an easier way to further his education/career, and that's where the west comes into play... and frankly, once one gets used to the comforts of life here, and gets into the process of F1/H1B/GC, its rare that one chooses to go back due to patriotism.
Pollution & Corruption are the only objectionable things in India for the middle class,
Maybe you can avoid pollution .. but avoiding bribing is impossible - http://www.hindu.com/2007/07/12/stories/2007071250150100.htm
But if you earn steady you can enjoy *family* life much better than in the US.
Tambram, your post #15 makes no sense. I just don't get why you think you f****d company A. Most of these companies agree to do you green card processing only after you work with them for 2 years. Then it's a certain amount of time before the stage when you can leave the company (few months to a year). Let's say a total of three years. So, for a mere 8000 bucks, they were able to lock you into being their employee for 3 years. During that time, they don't even have to pay you a competitive salary (just needs to be a legal amount). No amount of money can buy them this sort of bonded labor from an American for three years. So, you're the one what got f****d by company A.
And oh, nowadays, it's very common for companies to say "hey, why do you need a GC now? You can work for 6 years on an H1-B. We can think about GC as you near that time limit." Beautiful.
like priya in #68, i'd love to see a post on the 2-body problem.
I wonder if the goras are getting antsy about losing the America that created from a wilderness into a first world society to the browns of india and mexico. The next few years will be interesting.....
Going back... Why would anyone with marketable skills and even a modicum of cultural roots not want to go back. India is in the middle of perhaps the biggest economic and cultural boom that any of us will see in our lifetimes.
If money is your passion, there are more opportunities to make real money than one would ever see in New York or London. If its entrepreneurship, the untapped opportunities are immense. If development is your passion, you can be an agent in an unprecedented transformation. If its cultural vibrancy, you could be part of the development of a uniquely Indian post-modern culture.
The more time I spend back in India, the more I realize that is where the action really is. Its really a no brainer.
Thank you - unless we can make the immigration issue hit the U.S. in the economic jugular, we will never really see true justice in this matter
To all those people who have been shafted by the INS - come over to Australia. You can become a citizen in 3 years. Then you can apply for a special category work visa (mostly unfilled) to work in the USA.
USA is great but at some point you have to say is it worth being jerked around. I decided not to be desperate.
Sending flowers is not Satyagraha. A fast unto death is real Satyagraha. Will a fast unto death work in the USA? Yes, but how many men / women are willing to fast unto death. But it also needs to be co-ordinated with a media campaign. It needs just two or three persons to die before the mess gets fixed. Guilt is a very powerful weapon and works nearly everytime (not with the Nazis and Afrikaners!!)
Immigration is political and needs to be dealt with politically.
melbourne desi, if you keep making these open invitations, John Howard is going to put you on a boat and push you to Indonesia.
or New Zealand. My uncle managed to facilitate the citizenship process with a few bucks under the table, and my aunt, managed to retain her citizen's right to full and free healthcare despite living abroad for 8 years. That's magic!
Not Indonesia - most likely Nauru.
We need more desis here so that we can consitute a voting bloc and I can stand for election ;)
Oz is as big as continental USA excluding Alaska. Lots of wide open space with a booming economy. Plus , we have public healthcare :) And my pet theme - no affirmative action.
Like civilised nations we play the greatest game :) This year India plays Oz in the boxing day test match - yippeeee!!!!
On a serious note, immigration has been the highest in over a century. The govt is quite bullish on inviting skilled people over.
If you apply from USA, time to get a green card is less than 1 year.
While I do not approve of Ghandi, his tactics sometimes work, even in these times. Only good can come frome this.
latest update on the effect of gandhigari from the news tab - USCIS reverses its decision