December 14, 2007
Two DBDs Murdered at LSU (2 Updates)News
A simple way to take the pulse of the Mutiny is to pay attention to tip volume and composition. When the same story is sent in (and for a period is the ONLY story submitted to the tip line), it’s a powerful indicator of what you want to talk about…today, it’s tragedy at a major American public university:
Two students were found shot to death in a home invasion at a Louisiana State University apartment, and officials decided to keep the campus open Friday while police searched for three suspects.
The victims, Chandrasekhar Reddy Komma and Kiran Kumar Allam, both Ph.D. students from India, were found inside an apartment at the Edward Gay complex late Thursday night after authorities received an emergency call. [yahoo]
That emergency call came from Allam’s pregnant wife, who discovered the murder scene at her apartment.
The 911 call was made by Allam’s pregnant wife, who returned home and found the men dead. Authorities said both men had been shot in the head once in what is described as an area with one of the highest crime rates in the city.
Komma, who was studying biochemistry, was found bound with a computer cable, while Allam, who was in the chemistry programme, was near the front door. Initial reports said nothing appears to have been stolen from the house. [TOI]
The apartments are a vulnerable, easy target:
The apartment building where the shootings took place is designated for married and graduate students, and is near a field on the 2,000-acre campus where the university’s band practices. A cluster of pale yellow cinderblock, three-story buildings, it sits on the edge of the campus…
The complex has a tall fence separating it from the off-campus neighborhood, but the apartments have no gates or surveillance cameras…attempted break-ins and holdups are common at the complex. [yahoo]
Logically, TOI zeroed in on the anxiety most of you conveyed in your emails:
Phani Mylavarpu, a 26-year-old Indian student pursuing a mechanical engineering Ph.D., told the local Times-Picayune that he was an acquaintance of both victims, having met them at social events of the Indian Student Association, which brings together Indian students on the campus.
Mylavarpu, a former president of the group, said Indian students have spent much of the day talking with each other talking with each other about the crimes and fielding telephone calls from concerned relatives and friends from India.
The homicides appear to be ”a random, unfortunate act” not targeting the victims because of their nationality, Mylavarpu said, echoing the local authorities.
But he said international students, who often congregate together and comprise a considerable portion of the residences in select housing units, want to be assured that their safety is a priority for campus police.
”I’m not blaming the safety system,” he said, ”but things like this are still happening, and it leaves us concerned on behalf of the international student community.” [TOI]
Many of you who sent this story in noted that you were especially affected by it because you are DBDs who are currently in grad school, just like Komma and Allam were. Just last week, one of our readers in Bangalore asked me if America was “so violent”; he was thinking about pursuing a degree in this country but he was worried about “racism and crime”. My insouciant “it’s not so bad here” seems really lame, right now.
My thoughts and prayers are with their families, especially Allam’s wife and the unborn child she will have to explain this senseless loss to, one day.
::
On an uglier note— Shame on LSU. I couldn’t believe one of the links I read (now altered, natch) which quoted a school official as stating that this was an opportunity to test out the emergency text messaging alert system which many Universities implemented after the Virginia Tech tragedy. Thank goodness the Telegraph hasn’t been “cleansed” and thank goodness they’re calling LSU out. Read the shitty, callous message for yourself, below.
“The tragic homicides that took place on campus on Thursday evening provided an opportunity for the university to test its new emergency text-message system. Thanks to feedback from members of the LSU community, university officials learned that not everyone who had registered their cellphones with the system received a message.
“The university is now investigating the problem with clearTXT, which is the text-message service provider, and is working to fix this problem rapidly. LSU will provide moreinformation when the problem is resolved.”
Investigate where your tact and decency went, while you’re at it.
::
UPDATE #1- The bloggers (who, like the victims, came here for grad school as well) at UberDesi have their gumshoes on— they’re on the trail of the “missing quote”, you know, the one about how this was an opportunity?
…the student newspaper of LSU has been inundated with complaints. The particular story is no longer on the front page of the student news paper and digging for half an hour, proved useless. All we managed to unearth from our history was the story with partial comments.
Hoping that I could get the LSU Reville to cough up more information on why they had “broken” their commenting system on one particular news story I called the Editor In Chief Mr. Justin Fritscher, only for someone else to answer the phone. “Yes our system is broken and we are trying to fix it, we are not sure about when and if the comments will be back” (paraphrased) was the answer. [UD]
UPDATE #2-
sreechettan over at SAJAForum points us here, where
we discover that it might not have been random:
LSU Chancellor Sean O’Keefe said…the men “appeared to be targeted for reasons unknown.”
“This does not appear to be a random event,” O’Keefe said. [2advocate]
Developing… :(
anna on December 14, 2007 06:11 PM in News · T·r·a·c·k·b·a·c·k address · Direct link · Email post
what a horrible senseless act. I am deeply sorry for the families of Kiran and Chandrasekhar.
it's below the surface but it does come through. international indian students are a sub-human rendering on the urban landscape - a caricature, but never quite one of Us.for those who'll come later lamenting the oversensitiveness of the blogger and this response, the referenced statement is a poor choice of words. a better choice of words was warranted. if this was the official statement, that official needs to be taken to task. if it was some geek with a bad moment, i hope he gets a tongue lashing from her/his boss.
This is unimaginably tragic. The Yahoo news piece says authorities are not able to tell if the shootings were random or targeted. Has there been any update since?
I can't imagine what the families and community must be going through. My thoughts are with them during a most trying time.
Anna,
First thanks for posting the article. I had read it this morning and sent it out to various groups I am connected with. It is good that Sepia had it up within the 24 hour period. My heart goes out to the wife, and the families, as well as the community out in LA. The minimal details that are available provide more conjecture and frustration than information.
The concerns you brought up about not only callousness, but also the loss of information as a story is tracked throughout the day is incredibly important as well.
Awful. Profound sympathies to the families.
I'm no crime expert, but the facts here don't strike me as obviously being a random break-in. Not the MO of your average robbers. But, who knows....time will tell.
One of victim's wife was pregnant. So it is going to be horrible for both the mother and kid when it is born.
Sigh! To come half way around the world to do a PhD and to be murdered by uneducated local scum.
Find peace, brothers.
Another Indian killed in a home invasion robbery in Los Angeles suburb of Diamond Bar, which has a large Indian population.
http://indiapost.com/article/communitypost/1599/
Looks like his Mercedes was taken in the robbery as well. His wife also found him dead here. Seems like these home invasion robberies are on the rise, or at least more commonly reported right now. Sean Taylor, the LSU people, this man, we've had a few others out here in California. I thought this was a thing of the 1990's more than today.
Because they couldn't have tested the system with a mock drill or anything.
What a callous response to a devastating event.
Als, in context of the person with the unfortunate turn of phrase - before ascribing racial animus (as I did earlier and apologize now for doing so) it may be best to hold off. it may yet be an international student with a poor command over english working on the notification system deployment*. He still deserves a tonguelashing though.
*where i went to school, there were all kinds of research assistantships available in different departments who needed technical work done for cheap in return for tuition fee waivers (i got through grad school like that :-/). it's all hypothesis, but better to be prudent.
The online article at Deccan Herald.com mentions that Allam's father is a famous Telugu author.
In the bay area there used to be a gang that robbed desi homes for gold/jewelry and valuables. But student housing seems like an unlikely target.
Not the first time the LSU area has had shocking homicides in recent years. Though this present case seems like a robbery rather than a serial killing.
But student housing seems like an unlikely target.
First, as a LSU alum, my heartfelt condolences.
Now to the point, a lot of American Universities are adjacent violent neighborhoods of high crime (these neighborhoods happen to be extremely poor too). Examples: parts of... LSU, Columbia University, Wright State, University of Chicago.
Parts of LSU are next to an urbanized ghetto areas, and Edward Gay apartment complex happens to be in that area. One of the LSU graduate student housing is Edward Gay apartment complex, and often new international graduate students use that option. Baton Rouge as a whole has pockets of very crime incidences.
So nothing can be said of the motive. Probably, some sort of robbery to buy drugs, I would guess.
But it is quite tragic.
My heart goes out to the family. Here is a support fund set up for their family :
http://appl003.lsu.edu/unv002.nsf/9faf000d8eb58d4986256abe00720a51/968cc4435caa329b862573b1007c1456?OpenDocument
a lot of American Universities are adjacent to violent neighborhoods
so were the killers white or black? or does it not matter ?
O'Keefe is the former head of NASA by the way.
# 11, 12:
The strange thing is, this doesn't look like a robbery--report above says nothing taken; and most robbers don't go out of their way to kill.
I think Columbia has improved significantly (though this will be disputed by the "gentrification is evil" set) over the past decade. A Senegalese PhD student at the University of Chicago was recently killed in a robbery murder.
My condolences to the parents of of Komma and Allam
The strange thing is, this doesn't look like a robbery--report above says nothing taken; and most robbers don't go out of their way to kill.
Unless high on drugs, not finding enough money, or pissed off for some reason (people who broke in felt threatened at some point, upset on not finding enough cash for their heist, or just upset at damn phoreners or their girl friends (boy friends) had made them in foul mood earlier in the day).
Moral: There are no cardinal rules for evolution of robbery. I cannot (or anyone) can say anything with the news available. However, that area of Baton Rouge is very shadey, and it is quite sad for these students, and their families.
I can bet my very dear wife's behind that this is yet another Black on South Asian hate crime.
First of all, my condolences to the families of Komma and Allam. May the men rest in peace.
That really pisses me off. A tragedy is not supposed to be a time to test an emergency system.I also think that if these were white students who were murdered, it would definitely be a top story.
You may have to kiss your dear wife's behind goodbye if you make that bet. Too many people are jumping to the conclusion that this was a bunch of black crackheads looking for drug money. As if grad students from India are loaded with cash. These guys were targeted and shot once each in the head. Nothing was stolen. Looks like a hit job.
Its quite possible that the KKK or neo-nazis are behind this. Louisiana almost elected the klansman and neo-nazi David Duke Governor a while back and now has an indian governor-elect, Bobby Jindal. That surely must rub the white racists there the wrong way. The attack took place within blocks of Jindal's headquarters apparently.
jhamu, I wouldnt jump to conclusion's like that. Dont get that "OHHHH the blacks are coming to get us" attitude.
If it wasnt for black people then the Indian people in America either wouldnt be here or would be going to "colored only" schools and drinking from the "colored fountain". If it was a black person, who did this then that individual is a piece of trash, not his whole race.
Guys, can we not jump to these conclusions yet? The investigation is on, we would be better served to comfort the families of the victims in what must surely be trying times.
it doesn't matter how educated or what color the criminals were....this is plain tragic! i can't believe some of the comments on here that are so focused on the idiots behind it.
i believe justice should be served indeed, but the person's background doesn't matter bc they are obviously disturbed. i mean whoever did this killed these guys execution style :(
also i think it is important to focus on the victims. losing these victims is a lot to us all it's a loss to LA, to the US, to the Des and the world. more likely than not, these scholars would have gone on to make great contributions in their respective fields.
also i know many of us can relate to and empathize with the victims, because of our backgrounds or experiences with DBDs. i mean this just hits close to home. but let's not forget that our country is way too violent--- period. whether it's large scale attacks like the recent mall shooting in NE or small scale, yet horrific attacks as here.
we need to really think about what we can do to make this world a safer place starting at home. it's bad enough we are engaged in 'war' abroad but how can we protect civilians right here?
Doesn't seem like KKK or neo-Nazis. Atleast that's not the profile of the people the authorities are looking for. From the article linked in the post:
What a shameful, horrific event. My condolences to the families and friends of the victims.
(The posts #22 and #23 offer very realistic explanations and views. What a sad situation.)
Its quite possible that the KKK or neo-nazis are behind this. Louisiana almost elected the klansman and neo-nazi David Duke Governor a while back and now has an indian governor-elect, Bobby Jindal. That surely must rub the white racists there the wrong way. The attack took place within blocks of Jindal's headquarters apparently.
First, this thread is about condolences, and balm to the grieved.
Second, do you (Robby) even know anything about the neighborhood or Baton Rouge where the killing happened.
True, LA and Baton Rouge has its own share of KKK and Neo-Nazis. Baton Rouge was in 60s, on the forefront, during civil rights movement, and segregated delis, and rest rooms.
However, that neighborhood next to Edward Gay Apartments is an area with African American dominated projects. FYI: A Klansman would get shot dead in 10 minutes there.
If you drive 10 minutes on that road, you hit downtown, and probably that is where Bobby Jindal's transition team is situated (I am not sure but guessing).
NB: I do not wish to start a race baiting session here, but, speculation without knowledge of the area (like Klansman did it) is as useless as it comes.
What a tragic incident. My heart goes out to both the families.
Anna- Thanks for blogging about this news.
The title "DBD Nightmare" sounds a bit odd.
Bobby Jindal's transition team is situated in one of the buildings of LSU campus, quite close to "Death Valley" football stadium. Their are situated in:
Kirby Smith Hall, LSU Campus
Baton Rouge, LA 70810
Practically, across the football stadium is David Gray Apartments, and across the David Gray Apartments is also the railways tracks, and houses with "garrison" windows, unrentable houses. Railways tracks has been a "divide" in American towns and cities for centuries.
If something can come of out of this tragedy, is that, new international students should make inquiries about the safety of the region before they pick a place to live. Also, Universities should not only provide the crime statistics of the campus (which by law they are supposed to, and they do now) but also of the city. In that way, a young student - be it American, International can make informed decisions.
Terrible tragedy. The dead bodies will probably be flown back to India. I can only imagine the scenes at the Airport. I wont be surprised if this was a robbery gone bad. I am a big propoent of the felony murder rule where if you accidently or inadvertently end up killing someone while committing violent felonies like robbery, you are charged with murder.
Sometimes I wish the assailants are made to observe and live with the family and see their grief, the burial and all that is destroyed. In India, a lot of Muslims engage in this rather self flagellating way of burying the dead where the dead is placed on a cot on the way to the cemetary and the cot is supported on the shoulders of family and friends. Its called 'kandha dena' (giving shoulder) I dont know if the Hindus do that or not.
not being up on all the desi slang what does DBDs stand for?
Desh Born Desi.
In India, a lot of Muslims engage in this rather self flagellating way of burying the dead where the dead is placed on a cot on the way to the cemetary and the cot is supported on the shoulders of family and friends. Its called 'kandha dena' (giving shoulder) I dont know if the Hindus do that or not.
Hindus do the exactly same with long procession, sometimes from home to cremation site, with a chant "Ram Naam Satya Hai" (The name of Rama is the truth).
For the matter, even the Christians do the same, but just a shorter walk with shouldering (or pall bearer as they call it).
For the matter, even the Christians do the same, but just a shorter walk with shouldering (or pall bearer as they call it).
I think burials in the US are more formal and organized with less involvement of the family.
Tragic. Hope they catch them.
In India the dead body is kept at home for at least 24 hours prior to creamation/burial. Is there a law preventing this is here?
In India the dead body is kept at home for at least 24 hours prior to creamation/burial. Is there a law preventing this is here?
Depends on the state. For example, keeping the body for 24 hours at home might not be possible in cases where the person dies from a communicable disease and in such cases, in most states, he must be buried or cremated within 24 hours.
how tragic and terrible. my heart goes out to the families, especially the wife and unborn baby =(
It's a very sad story. Hope they catch the perpetrators.
Btw, the TOI has done very little original reporting and doesn't deserve to be linked to. The only thing they "zeroed in on" was a way to steal a few paragraphs from the Times-Picayune article.
yeah, the problem with this country is that too many jobless kallus and too many stupid goras, ready to kill at a moment's notice. Brown life is not of much value for these.
Anyway - typically news like this invites several types of desi comments:
1. 'oooh such a tragedy.. my heart goes out.. sooo saaadddd.. sob sniff boo hoo..' (these typically come from the ones who write 'kudos' and 'hats off' in good news comments ).
2. ' some idiotic kallu/gora did this. oh please note that I am against only that particular kallu/gora. I do not want to be seen as a racist. Please note that. pray that this statement does not affect my greencard application. or will it? should I delete this post? but how?'
3. ' let's not jump to conclusions. the killer could have been anyone. It could even have been another desi. Afterall, we desis are bigtime racists. desis are bad. look at that nasty country my parents escaped from. riots, killings.. How can you ever say that usa is bad and americans are bad just because some americans kill you desis? I am sure it was another desi. My american boy/girl friend says americans are such caring people. see how they say 'how you doing' whever they see you in the street? So stop ascribing racist animus. Did you notice my vocabulary? oh america america..'.
Only one thing missing - some real feeling of loss or anger.
Meanwhile ToI reports that:
The Indian government has rushed two consular officials to Baton Rouge to render all possible assistance to local authorities and Indian students stunned by the murder of two doctoral scholars from Andhra Pradesh on the Louisiana State University Campus.
KB Pillai from the Indian Consulate-General in Houston reached Baton Rouge on Friday evening and Alok Pandey from the Indian Embassy in Washington was expected there on Saturday morning as Indian students across US mourned the brutal execution-style slaying of the two students.
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Indian_officials_leave_for_Louisiana_varsity/articleshow/2623940.cms
Wow. Stay classy, #40...
Why is that whenever a story like this breaks SM turns into a photo-negative version of the Freep or Little Green Footballs for a night?
Holy crap. I was born and raised in that complex when my dad was getting his masters from LSU...
yup, the value of desi life to an amru..
LSU's view, I guess, goes like this:
'two of those brown things who complicated work for little pay and stay over in some cinderblock dwellings where those types stay appear to have been shot. Oh well, gotta do an investigation now since it's the law.., and more importantly find some replacements for the prof whose work those two were doing. No problem, plenty where the came from.
oh oh its a great chance to test out that cellphone response thingie we have been putting together. someone get on it. if the test fails, we might have to wait till another of those dies like this'.
Wonder if they would ahve been so callous if a gora/gori had been killed?
Where are the crying students? where are the candle light vigils? Where are the shows of support?
looks like the life of a desi grad student is worth nothing to anyone.
and thank you the mutineer who posted this, for clarifying that these are two 'DBD's.
May I ask - why the distinction, when an 'indian grad student' would have been enough? Is it so that the ABCDs/ABDs can mourn a little less or not at all? 'not one of ours, just a DBD. move on', is it?
AnotherDesi, the DBD is harmless dscriptive term. If anythjing, it makes one sadder for these students bevcause their parents have to wonder a country away what is going on with the case.
As far as the attitude of cops towards crimes on browns, I have noticed on more than one occasion where the cops seem totally indifferent to the plight of some Indian victims.
another desi: you hit the nail on the head. DBD crime - Report it and move on.
Thats how the media is also treating this case. Doesnt matter that the Columbia "noose" incident and the Delaware 2 am shooting got more media coverage than this one. None of the evening news program even mentioned it.
Surprised/Another Desi, based on your behavior here and on previous threads, we can see a pattern of ignorance and assumptions. Your tendency to switch handles on the same thread is dishonest and a desperate way to fake support for your "side". We ban for this sort of "gaming".
DBD isn't a term of disrespect.
DBD is specific. In a country where all of us, whether born here or not are often considered "outsiders", using the purportedly superior "Indian Grad Student" could mean someone who risked plenty to bravely come here in pursuit of something worthwhile...or the children of said someones. It's short-hand for members of the 1st generation.
Instead of looking for insult where there isn't any, ask yourself why your comments on other threads were roundly condemned. There is nothing but sorrow here, from people who see in these victims either themselves or their parents.
You are talking irrational nonsense as always, Kush. As if klansmen go around wearing white sheets all the time.
Can't imagine what that pregnant wife must have gone thru.
Wonder if Bobby Jindal would do anything abt the safety of students, not just Indians but any international student who, due to lack to funds ( and hence no car), has to live near the school even if its in a bad area.
Here in Los Angeles, USC is in a very bad area too. Its smack in the middle of downtown LA and just recently had a terrible incident of a attack on a girl.
Unfortunately Jindal or any other state/govt official is under very little or no obligation to protect private citizens/non citizens:
Memorial Service
Coverage on CNN headline news. 986 stories on google news. Story is not being ignored.
A post on the ABCNews comments page on a possible motive for the killngs:
The poster says he is an Indian grad student at LSU.
This should have been much more widely and prominently reported. I agree with Brown Writer at 21 that the business of announcing the emergency systems result was very callous and in poor taste. I hope these murders will be properly investigated ---I think people/Mutineers should e-mail Bobby Jindal's office to urge/demand a thorough and speedy investigation. Imagine the extreme shock of being pregnant and coming home one evening to find your husband and his friend bound, gagged and shot dead. The baby is already harmed. The wife and families should sue LSU on whatever grounds can be brought to describe how the University enabled these murders by providing inadequate security on their turf.
I can't say much... but some people at LSU think this was definitely not your run-of-the-mill home invasion. There may be some money-lending issues going on or something like that, but there is definitely an opinion that this may not be as random as we are led to believe...
will let you know more of what i can as soon as i find out. I'm going there post-Christmas .. hoping all my friends are safe :(
SM intern: Thank you for addressing the cringe-worthy remarks of Surprised/Another Desi. In fact they should be removed because they are absolutely racist. But could you clarify what you meant by the following as most of the Indian grad student do travel far (and do risk a lot most of the time) for something worthwhile
And all those up in arms about use of DBD term: If you have been reading this site long enough (or did some research before increasing your BP), you'd know that ABD and DBD are terms that were discussed and thought to be more appropriate rather than the derogatory FOB/ABCD.
I agree with zuni, DBD much better than FOB (except when a FOB uses FOB, makes it funny).
And as far as the location of universities go, I have to agree, they always seem to have areas that need to be avoided.
The media is mentioning the incident, but I am yet to see anyone raise their voice about the callous email. Now that the student newspaper has removed the story and the comments, they might have ended the issue.
Since ABD and DBD are often terms that hold cultural signposts (that is, we can make some inferences about their life and experiences within the US), out of sheer curiosity - what would you call people who were born in a South Asian country, but moved to the US at age two, and therefor have more in common with ABDs?
first of all, I am very saddened by this news, and my heart goes out to the families.
I hope this will cause Baton Rouge and LSU officials (including Jindal, et al) to address some of the chronic dysfunction that may be pertinent to this terrible event. i lived on Roosevelt St in a slummy, roach-filled shotgun opposite ed gay apts from 85-89 when i was an undergrad at LSU. i couldn't afford anywhere else, and it was within walking distance to campus and my job waiting tables (on Nicholson). i was mugged at gunpoint twice, and a friend of mine was raped on Aster st. Then i moved to Chimes st, two doors from the Bayou, where I was mugged again.
*All* of the residential areas north of campus have been very poor and crime-ridden for decades. my parents, who both attended LSU in 60s remember chronic problems and the odd sensational incident in that tension-filled zone between privilege and poverty. the question is, after all these years of documented problems, why hasn't LSU (who for obvious reasons won't publicize these problems) invested the money, to either:
1) fund the construction of grad/married student housing in a better area--after all, mostly foreign students, paying hefty foreign-student fees, live there. Surely the money could've been allocated (perhaps with private partnership) to develop a complex on the south side of campus, which has been explosively developed in the last ten years. I am always astounded when i return to visit my family during the holidays how fast things have changed on the south and west side of campus, and it is striking how the north side remains the same. Foreign students depend on the school for guidance about safe areas to live, and there is an assumption that on-campus housing should be even safer. This has never been the case, unfortunately, at LSU, which remains vast, sprawling, and open.
2) fund local community efforts to make the surrounding neighborhoods more liveable generally. for *years* there has been no supermarket near campus, for instance, impacting both students and local residents with no cars. meanwhile bus service continues to suck, serving primarily as a kind of maid-ferrying shuttle for poor black women from north of campus to the posh suburbs southwards. Surely LSU could do something concrete to make the university more relevant to the local community. I am very glad not to be in Baton Rouge anymore--when i left I felt like a rat leaving a sinking ship.
Finally, I agree with the posters above that the whole text alert issue has been exceptionally callously handled. And it seems especially offensive that the failures of the alert system often threaten to overtake the news articles that should be focusing on the facts surrounding the terrible crime. The mom (quoted in one of the articles) complaining about how her daughter's whole sorority didn't get the alert is simultaneously galling and boring because sorority row is one of the prettiest and most well-guarded areas southeast of campus. The alert system issue seems like a red-herring and should be dropped from the discussion period.
I was referring to the crimes recounted by Baton Rouger in # 62.
Jhamu: Why is it that it is generally not safe for women in India to walk around on their own ? What does the cess pool that is the Indian criminal justice system say about us ?
louiecypher, to stay on topic, if an American grad student in India were murdered at home while living in on campus housing, don't you think there would be less talk of whether everyone's phone beeped or texted right afterwards?
amrita (#63): I mean the news reportage on the killings. While it's perfectly valid for LSU to be concerned that their system is not working as planned, I believe it is a mistake for LSU officials and news media reporters to report on the two issues in the same breath. Not only is it distracting, but it's simply bad PR: it frames everything in a local-news perspective, with all its provincial prejudices: "omg, how does that news affect *me and only me*?" The story is the tragic loss of two lives, not whether sorority girls should lock the doors of their well-landscaped mansions. Had the news media not conveyed the news so muddily, it might not have become the racialized issue it seems to have become for some posters here. I believe that LSU would have announced the failures of their alert system just as clumsily no matter who was killed on campus; LSU bureaucrats and security force are as incompetent as can be expected of any big institution.
Got it ex-baton rouger. Even if it's just clumsy PR, and I'm not sure big necessarily means clumsy, I think there's negligence at play here. I mean, why don't they have basic security arrangements in place in such a setting/surroundings? no gates? no surveillance cameras? How are foreigners supposed to be savvy enough to cope?
In that case, I doubt you would use either term. They probably would use Indian and go into their backgrounds in the writeup. Look, the term DBD here was used merely as a shorthand to give us an instant picture of the victims. My feeling is that when we look at the title, we get an instant snapshot of the victims and how far their parents live. I don't think it is meant to be judgemental. This sense of outrage is getting out of hand. Whenever someone covers a tragedy, we seem to get posts whining about why SM did not cover this or that.
Ex Baton Rouger, excellent comments that give us a great picture of what is going on.
This is such a sad story. These two people living so far away from home, living away from their family, hoping to start a new family. Poverty is another obstacle that foreign grad students face. While American grad students aren't rich either, many internationals (especially DBDs, not talking of some rich students from certain countries) are significantly poorer. Just getting a car (in many places a necessity) and decent furniture takes years of saving. On top of that, many save up money from the small stipends to send home to their family in Desh. So many sacrifices for a chance at something... and then, BAM, all gone.
Another matter that may not seem such a big deal - I don't know if they were hoping to have their baby be an ABD. If the woman is on a dependent status (F2) and not a student/worker herself, she might have to leave the country immediately and not give birth here. Granted, it's much smaller a deal than the death of the father, but it could also be the death of a dream for the parents. I say this because I have known friends who (for reasons not too clear to me) dream of this and are really proud of their children being American, often proudly saying things like "She's a global citizen" or "I'm an alien/resident, but he's a CITIZEN". Most of all, I'm really sad for the wife. When she returns, what a horrible memory she will have of America, losing so much and going through so much sadness in a short time.
Hmmm, isnt that exactly how many if not most desis feel when they leave the desh? Would you prefer living in India instead?
In Bangalore the locals are starting to physically assault the IT pros, I hear.
"You hear"...
I go there every summer and yes with the advent of the IT industry things have become very expensive. But assaulting IT workers...???? Please link to articles in newspapers or magazines.
Leaving India is as good as leaving a sinking ship! WOW! You certainly have a low opinion of immigrants, eh!
Amrita: Jhamu had made a racist statement to the effect that "blacks murder & rape wherever they are" that was deleted by the SM Intern...that's what I was responding to. I am not moved by the fact SM readers might disagree with me, because for the most part they know a judge/MLA/IPS officer within one degree of separation and so of course Indian justice works for them.
Is the communications from LSU hamfisted ? Yes. Would it have been better communicated if the victims were white, I don't know this is LSU and not some Ivy where they hire heavy hitter corporate PR types to keep the endowment money rolling in. Could be ineptitude or it could be racism. Would you care to examine the use of the English language in the Indian press ? Murderers are described as "miscreants", what broad conclusions are you willing to draw about the value of life in India from that ?
I don't know this is LSU and not some Ivy where they hire heavy hitter corporate PR types to keep the endowment money rolling in
LSU, while being a major state school, an ex-NASA chief as their current chancellor, flagship university with enormous state resources put there from time immemorial (since Huey P Long loved LSU to death and powerful legislators in Louisiana are always LSU Tigers), once a basketball ball powerhouse, now in baseball, and football (twice in national championship in last 5 years and a current football coach with 3 million dollar annual salary) - LSU has a long history of bad PR - like dis-enrolling hundreds of iranian students during iran hostage crisis, and later relenting, the list never ends.
I have been seriously thinking of writing directly to the Chancellor. He should know about the faux pas.
Mytri,
Article discussing disenchantment about the IT industry and assault upon IT workers:
http://outlookindia.com/full.asp?fodname=20071217&fname=Cover+Story+%28F%29&sid=1
Yes. Would it have been better communicated if the victims were white, I don't know this is LSU and not some Ivy where they hire heavy hitter corporate PR types to keep the endowment money rolling in
The answer is Yes. It would have been different if the victim was white.
LSU also has had one of the largest single donor endowment in American educational history - by Pennington family foundation - which made the Pennington BioMedical Center there - one of its kind in the world
It takes brave, wise men to somehow link this tragedy to Christianity, so that they have a flimsy excuse to insult a religion they find inferior and inauthentic; in the name of efficiency, they spit out the name of LA's new Governor, too...better to tar two things with one trolling.
It is disgusting that one of you shamelessly suggested that people might brush off this horrific loss as anything less than an awful tragedy, because the victims "weren't saved". You are the worst ambassadors for whatever you stupidly think you are upholding or protecting. Don't you dare accuse me of filth that I certainly did not say, write or imply. Instead of libel, try masturbation if you need to get your jollies.
As for those courageous souls who curse us as "Goddamned ABCDs", you don't know what you're talking about (not that it will stop you from shitting in this swimming pool with your assumptions). I didn't unilaterally decide that we were going to use ABD and DBD as respectful, neutral "abbreviations", THE COMMUNITY DID. You'd know that if you read the blog instead of venting on it.
And finally, to the jerk whose comment was deleted- did it ever occur to you that I tried to blog about the story you said "we didn't have the guts to cover", but I couldn't bear to? I'm not a robot. I'm a human who experiences emotions. If I'm crying too hard to type, good golly, no post for you-- that's life. Deal. If I can't, I can't. If we can't, we can't. You need to get over your bizarre, irrational need for recognition of tragedies, which you feel like seeing blogged here.
THIS IS A BLOG. NOTHING MORE. STOP INSULTING US OR THREATENING US FOR NOT POSTING SOMETHING.
If it matters to you so much, where's your blog? Who made me your peon? I give all I can to this, which is more than I can say for you unbelievably negative few who pollute this community with your nastiness.
Wow, this is horrible on many fronts. It's been a while since I've been able to read this blog and I'm not happy to see a post on such tragedy. Thanks for writing about it because I had not heard about it yet.
@Anna (aka "I've HAD it") - I'm not sure which comments you are referring to (since it looks like they were deleted) but it sounds like they were crazy comments from crazy, frustrated, have no life people. You are so right that if people want to 'cover a story' then they should start their own blog or start their own campaign about it. I'm always surprised (maybe since I'm so new to blogging and putting myself out there in the Internet) that people can be so tacky, insensitive, and downright *&^holes about stuff just because they feel safe not saying it to your face. It takes guts to do what you do and write what you write about from many aspects and I admire that. Don't let it get to you.
Aruni, thanks. I am considerably calmer now and I wonder-- these people are obviously deeply affected by this tragedy...so why not give to the relief fund set up for the murder victims instead of anonymously typing deletable worthlessness here?
Dear Sepia Mutiny ( pro sikh and pro christian ),
Please provide coverage to the ethnic cleansing of Indians in Malaysia. As we speak many Indians are being tortured, and abused in Malaysia. If you dont cover this and spread awareness who will ?
It is great that you cover desi centric topics ranging from mundane to tantalizing.. but I urge you to
cover this issue.
1.8 million Indians are under attack in Malaysia and you dont even blink??
Thankyou,
Tamil Tigers.
p.s. dont try to ban our i.p. addresses, we can create 1999^10000 proxies.. just get the message.
cover the issue abhi tripathi of los angeles.
Tamil Tiger, go start your own blog somewhere else. If there is enough interest, people will come.
tamil tiger, that would be a bit pointless since there are only 2^32 distinct ip addresses possible, and even IPv6 will give you only 2^128 addresses. so creating such a large number of proxies would require a nat, and that defeats the entire purpose of creating them in the first place.
i can't dance but i do want to be part of your revolution, which is why i am offering this consultancy gratis.
sat sri akal!
hail mary!
I'm a LSU student who is white, but I grew up around many Indian families and I have to say they are some of Baton Rouge's most valuable families and I'm not the only one who recognizes this. I hope you all don't think that everyone outside of the Indian community in Baton Rouge is ignoring the tragedy.
I am so saddened by what happened on Thursday, and I am so embarrassed and angered, but unfortunately not surprised, by the way LSU has handled it. My fiance' used to live in Nicholson, the other apartment complex for married and graduate students, and he has been literally sick since we heard about Allam and Komma's murders. Ever since he moved into Nicholson, we have been screaming for police to step up patrols, to add security measures such as cameras and fences, to just fix up Nicholson and Ed Gay. It is sickening that LSU puts its brightest and most promising students and their families in the worst areas of campus and in the worst complexes. The apartments are so grossly neglected.
I just want to say how deeply saddened I am that we have lost two wonderful people in our community, and I want to apologize for how badly the administration has handled this. Many students have been calling for O'Keefe's resignation as a result of how awfully the entire thing has been botched. I hope you know though that so many students on our campus, both Indian and non-Indian alike, have the men and their families in our thoughts and prayers.
Silly question by an Indian- Are temporary residents (students, H1-B holders etc.) allowed to own guns? If yes, can then apply for & get conceal-carry permits?
louiecypher. you already got your best answer to your second question, the one without a question mark, from Kush Tandon. My answer to your last question is: None. What kind of behavior do you sometimes call police brutality in New York and LA?
Communiucations, whether clumsy or deft, certainly come second to nonexistent security arrangements for impoverished foreign students. They'll likely never fix this without a lawsuit.
And who are the spades you would wish to have called spades, O great Spadeville? Come on: Say what you have to say. Have the courage to express yourself, or if all you have to say is dim innuendo, go away.
We quake before the power of your cyberwar techniques, O Tigers. I just got the message. It says, " talk is cheap."
I myself am an LSU student, though I am not Indian. I had a biology lab with one of the victims, while we never really spoke, as I zoned out most of the class, he seemed like a good guy to me.
To those of you speaking as though you know what happened, kindly stfu. Not everyone in LA is the racist person you are.
Remember one thing, this was a tragedy. People died. The color of their skin isn't relevant. Two people, with families, friends, and loved ones are no longer on this earth.
Hopefully, those responsible are caught, and thankfully Louisiana has the death penalty.
I agree with #87. It's horrible to be racist. But, it's even more egregious of some posters to:
constantly accuse others of being racist, while
demonstrating the worst type of bigoted thinking oneself
So, everyone's a racist except for you? Especially those horrible black and white folks? You know, those ones that you *know* are ignorant racists? The ones who hate Indians and are out to get you?
I don't understand why desi's are so quick to say every crime is committed by blacks or have a hidden grudge against them. None of them have any first hand experiences. Right?? Lulz!!:-)
I am glad the wife was not home when this happened. Who knows what would have happened to her.
Priya, Chetna, Amrita etc
Since all three mentioned the plight of the pregnant wife without mentioning the victims. Just thinking what you would have said if the victims were women.
A tragedy is blogged and immediately all the vermin emerges? My esteem of the human race is at a new low.
My condolences to the families. Why are campus buildings situated right next to the worst neighbourhoods in town?
Why are campus buildings situated right next to the worst neighbourhoods in town?
Huge urban campuses in America (not campus towns, even there, New Haven has shady neighborhood next to campus) grow over 100s of years in all directions as vast sprawls (almost cities within cities), it is no wonder that they will in some parts touch poor and violent neighborhoods.
But...isn't it cheaper to locate campus buildings in the suburbs? I know it's further away, and that's what makes it cheaper. But it's also safer. And doesn't the student housing council own places in the centre as well? I guess the situation in my country is completely different though. Here the council owns a lot of extremely beautiful historical houses in the centre. Unfortunately, at the time of my application I could not get into those, as they are dominated by frat students. Now I probably could but it's too much of a hassle to move. I've got the best view of my city anyway.
Shouldn't student safety be a priority of the university/housing council though? In my town the complexes are not located in the 'worst' neighbourhood, I don't know about other cities, but I think the same is true there.
Suffer the grad students, they are the indentured cane cutters of the 21st century. Most of the white undergrads at the elite school I went to were on work study and are heavily in debt. The Ivys are not stocked by Exeter or Andover contrary to what you may think. Are the undergrads at a state school like LSU living a charmed life, drinking mint juleps while ther desi T.A.s dodge bullets ?
Something terrible has happened and there is not much info, so it seems like people are trying to fill the vacuum
There were no suburbs in the US until cars were developed, most unis predate this invention. So why not farmland ? I am not sure of the relative economic costs back then, but something like 50% of the US pop would have been engaged in agriculture back then. Secondly, you need critical mass of population to attract intellectual types. Getting young profs out to Stanford 120 years ago when the SF Bay Area was a cultural back water was no easy task
Oy, I came to see if there were any important updates on this tragic story in the comments section and got slammed by another horrible, vitriolic SM discussion thread. It's depressing.
Cheers to those of you who tried to stay above the fray and whose hearts were in the right places. For the rest, shame.
Wll, tw ndn stdnts mrdrd n yr wn bckyrd, nd w hv s mny cncrnd. gd kp it p!
Deleted
TML TGR
@ 99: I was more excited when I thought you were going to contain your struggle. No such luck, I see.
tamil tiger--why do you keep ignoring everyone's comments? if it's important to you, then start your own blog. Or email/call CNN/NY times/your news media of choice asking them to cover the story. your repeating is reminiscent of children whining when they don't get what they want. there are plenty of other more appropriate spaces for you to bring attention to this issue you raise, including the news tab on this site.
He is doing an admirable job of dragging his namesake groups name through the mud further with his vague threats (abhi of los angeles?! ha) and incoherent babble. The LTTE has enough problems with public perception, they don't need imbeciles appropriating their name to lash out on a public forum.
Dr Sp Mutny ( pro skh, pro chrstn, Pro Hnd, Pr Jw, Pr mslm, pr mrcn, Pr ndn, pr hmnty, pr blgsphr, pr pr pr ) & pr pr
Deleted
Since you don't seem to understand anything politely-phrased here's a very blunt tip, "tamil tiger".
Maybe if you stop with the stupid, inaccurate statements (pro sikh pro christian), this forum will be more likely to listen to you. If you want this blog's help, don't insult them. When they logically don't help you after you're an ass to them, don't act like they're oppressing you, when if anything, YOU are persecuting them with your threats and spam.
Your tactics give you something in common with the Malaysian Government-- chew on that...and hopefully, choke.
Tamil Tiger 2 @ 105:
This particular post and the related discussion surrounds the tragic news event. Please take your issue to the news tab or elsewhere. Would you show up at a funeral spouting rhetoric concerning an unrelated event? It is not that Sepia Mutiny won't necessarily cover what you are talking about, it is that you continue to bring it up in the wrong forum and ignore the productive advice of others.
Tamil Tiger:
Sure, but is masturbation ?
listen TT, you are coming across as a juvenile delinquent. by threadbombing you risk drying up support for your cause.
this forum is not necessarily an information dissemination center the way you intend it. the bulk of audience who frequent this, if they are potential sympathizers, are already aware of the tamil situation in malaysia. in order to grow the bandwidth for your cause, you are best to cultivate a more diverse audience. more into that later, but seriously guy, this kind of haranguing shows you up as an illiterate, intemperate, venal boor - and that just does not go across very well.
i have done this some time back in canada and am proud to say it worked.
a. Blogspot has a standard template wherein you can channel newsfeeds and video from youtube directly to your blog. Use key words like "malaysia tamil", "malaysia race preference", "bumiputra ..." etc. to funnel media content to your blog.
b. I would recommend you draft standard letters clearly articulating the tamil cause for directing to a. newspaper editors, b. npo's like AI c. foreign ministers. Try to be objective, and do not try to "shame" people into following your recommendation.
c. Surf the net to find the email addresses of your target audience. Or create a blog post that requests the indian diaspora to submit the email addresses for their local newspapers (eg lettertoed@thestar.ca for the toronto Star), their MP's etc.
d. Create a blog post asking the readers to submit the stock letter to the email/snailmail addresses that are provided.
e. submit a request for action to Sepiamutiny, uberdesi, ultrabrown, chapatimystery, pickledpolitics etc. who are genuinely sympathetic to your cause. it makes sense to engage them then, because that is what they do best, channel the diaspora's action in a given direct