is there anything I can do to unharden their hearts?

Feed them Crestor.

I guess Amardeep is seriously working on destroying the other mutineers in the most-commented upon contest.

I liked Pru's advice and the comments from other presumably white people were also thoughtful. However, I would say from my own experience - that the first option to try is gentle persistence. Confrontation is a viable but last option.

First of all take courage, the problem is not insoluble. Start talking about your significant other, bring him/her into the conversation as if it was the expected and natural thing. Next arrange a meeting at a non-emotional, neutral time and place - a meal out, an Indian concert.
To prepare youself read a book about the Japanese principle of KAIZEN - how to conquer a problem with relentless, small steps.

Take it from someone with a similar experience: Prudence is just about bang on the money.

The question at the end of the day is if the guy in question is willing to take the consequences of his parent's mixed messages. There is always a risk that it can go either way (at least in my experience) but if the price is worth paying i.e. you will always be seen as a slight abberation but you are together with the person you want to be with. Questions of cultural belonging, social circles etc. also come into it, not to mention the religous upbringing of potential offspring as well as language etc.

So you may not be able to have your cake and eat it, but if you can accept that then you are fine. Also, the risk of a family disowning the son is minimal especially when he demonstrates his resolve and they also see the good qualities of the person in question. For any of this to happen a meeting must be initiated of course. What follows may be a battle of prejudice against rationality, but if he is determined then this is the only sensible option.

has he met her parents? it isnt a one sided thing you know.
our man sounds like a callow capitulating coconut.

More and more as I near my thirties, I question why we spend so much time playing by our parents rules and reservations and anxieties into our adulthood when our futures are so clearly mapped here, with the rules of this land and in increasingly diverse circles that our parents aren't a part of.

Shielding your parents from your relationship, waiting till you're engaged, what have you will only hurt you in the long run. In other words, Curry and French Fries: man up. It's go time.

That was the story of my life, but it worked out in the end.

My Malayalee parents were horrified when I started dating my Jewish girlfriend, and did the same thing whenever the topic came up (change the subject, get angry, threaten to disown me, or just walk away). It was such a difficult few years for all of us, because deep down we knew that we still loved each other. Even though they repeatedly broke my heart with the horrible things they'd say in anger and frustration, I still understood that they genuinely meant well, even if it was misguided. I put my feelings on hold (as best as I could) and did everything that I could to keep the conversation lines open with them. Meanwhile, my girlfriend was on the receiving end of some horrible treatment from my parents (flat-out ignoring her at social gatherings, etc.), yet she was thoughtful enough to understand where they were coming from.

My parents and I weren't speaking at all by the time I was ready to propose, but I told them about it beforehand via letter, explained my reasons, and emphasized that my door would always be open, even though they were closing theirs. At the time, I was worried that I'd never hear from them, but I believed in my heart of hearts that I was still doing what was right for me.

The miracle for our family (I use that word because given everything that had gone on, it really does seem like one) is that not only did they come around, but they went above and beyond to put things right with my wife. I give her all the credit in the world for making the relationship work - a lesser person would have rightfully told them to f$%# off. They spent our engagement year getting to know each other, and getting to the point where they could trust, respect, and even love each other. It was a group effort, and it worked. The wedding was awesome, and my parents were enthusiastic and supportive about helping us incorporate our different cultures into our ceremony. My Mom even read up on Jewish holidays, which I never thought I'd see in a million years.

Six years since we started dating, almost three years since we were married, and things couldn't be better. My wife calls my parents "Mom" and "Dad" and *means* it. My parents adore the heck out of their grandson, babysit for us during the week, and make it a point to not to "take over" (i.e., respecting my wife's position as Mom). They also respect our personal space regarding our admittedly non-religious lives, even though that goes against what they know. We consider ourselves very fortunate.

The interesting thing is that while my parents apologized for how they'd treated my wife during the early stages of our dating, they never apologized for their reasoning. We respected that, because we'd taken the time to understand where they were coming from. We always understood why they thought they were doing the right thing, and we're grateful for their willingness to open their minds and hearts to welcome my wife to our family. My dad in particular makes it a point to refer to my wife as his "daughter", not "daughter-in-law" - and he certainly treats her that way.

It sounds like "Curry and French Fries" appreciates his parents' position, too. My advice would be to keep talking with them so that the issue is on the table, and to make sure that his girlfriend is open-minded enough to empathize with her potential in-laws' conflicted feelings. If he's serious about marrying her, then he needs to know that his potential wife is willing to help with the bridge-building and not just retreat to her family. I don't blame her at all for feeling "embittered", but he's going to have to help her get over it (assuming that she's willing to), so that they can all make this work. Although we've never discussed it specifically, I believe that a big reason why my parents made such a sincere effort to understand and accept us was because they'd eventually realized that we'd been making the same sincere effort toward them.

I had a similar experience too, although my girlfriend (now wife) isn't white, merely Sri Lankan and Catholic. I think the best decision I made was to insist that they meet her soon after I told them about her. The sooner they meet her, the less time they would have to stew over a phantom person and imagine horrible things about her.

Much of their apprehension melted away when they met her, and when they saw she wasn't that different after all.

So, my advice would be for Mr. Curry to insist his parents meet his girlfriend, and let them know that he fully expects them to be a part of his life after marriage with her.

Tell your parents to grow up.

M. Nam

Project 37 -- thanks for sharing that inspiring story!

Khoofia -- come on, man. Dating someone non-Indian does not make you a coconut. That's just the kind of hurtful attitude we're trying to overcome here.

I have been in a similar situation. Although, my parents (and hers) have been very supportive so I can't really say it's the same situation. My closest buddy, though, is in the same exact soup. What he is trying, and what kind of worked for me, was that you have to assert on both the parties that they are very important in your life and you don't want you life to be lived in two halves. Tell your, meaning Mr. Curry's, parents that you are going to be their son whatever happens and you expect the same from them. Ditto to the girlfriend. Make them spend time with each other. Most Indian parents, that I have known, would melt once they realize that this girl would take good care of their child AND THEMSELVES (very important). And ask Ms Fries not to enter into any argument with the uncle and aunty at least for the first few months.

I think most of these "disown you" style threats are pretty empty and that most parents do coem around given time. But I know a family who offered their son a million dollars (and they had the $ to make it credible too) to walk away from his relationship with a non-Indian girl. He stayed with her (of course!) but he parents have not yet come around to this day. He got married to that girl about 8 yrs ago, but his parents did not attend the wedding and have never met the girl. It seems so sad for all parties involved, esp. the son & his wife, that it's shocking they're putting their so-called "pride" above everyone's happiness, presumably including their own...

so how about the reverse situation: indian-american girl and white boyfriend?

the dynamics are quite different there depending on other factors like how macho your boyfriend is and how little effort he makes to see just how manipulative and mind-numbingly abusive these kinds of remarks from the girl's parents can be...add to that busy schedules and high power careers and you've got an indian soap on your hands....i don't doubt the difficulty of pushing an interracial relationship of any kind into society or our conservative parents' mouths...but i wonder why i'm having such a hard time getting my father to acknowledge my existence anymore...and why my boyfriend seems to think that i should defy my parents without wincing? i should say that my brother's girlfriend probably never expects such a thing from him and her patience is probably ranked with the gods...

Khoofia -- come on, man. Dating someone non-Indian does not make you a coconut. That's just the kind of hurtful attitude we're trying to overcome here.

A couple of scenarios - the woman has little attachment to either of her parents and/or is from a broken home. This doesnt bode well for the relationship because it suggests their view of the family is likely going to diverge after a while. if the guy is so eager to take on the blame then it is possible he's being sent on a guilt trip. i've known instances when women (desi and non-desi) have abused guys in similar situations by questioning their adulthood/masculinity. that would definitely be a red flag.

reg. a coconut - i've unfortunately never dated desi yaar - so didnt mean coconut in the sense that yu took it. i meant it in the sense the guy may be too eager to believe his desi family is regressive.

Oops... "nonono Amitabh Amardeep, you got me all wrong".

sorry. i was just in a rush to get that out. i most def'ly didnt want to diss the guy for dating non-desi. that would be so not cool.

5 · RainbowSkittles said

More and more as I near my thirties, I question why we spend so much time playing by our parents rules and reservations and anxieties into our adulthood when our futures are so clearly mapped here, with the rules of this land and in increasingly diverse circles that our parents aren't a part of.

Khoofia, thanks for clarifying that.

This is what bothered me in the initial letter:

if I did “bring home an American girl” that they would disown me. After two years, I told them about the relationship, and they were rightfully hurt and upset I’d kept it a secret.

They were rightfully hurt? What did you expect your son to do when you threaten to disown him from the only family he knows? Of course he's going to hide the relationship to keep peace in the home. Indian children have a strong innate instinct to protect their parents from pain, and we'll often extend ourselves to our limit trying to sheild them when possible.

Their threat to disown him was childish and completely an empty threat. The guy needs to man up and stand uo next to his girlfriend and hold her by his side proudly.

Oh boy, do i have something to share! My experience is not with my parents but of my telugu boyfriend's parents. we are both hindu and my boyfriend's family is kshatriya and my family is brahmin. Not only did my boyfriend's parents threaten to disown him for marrying someone non-telugu in a different caste (even though my parents don't give a crap), his mother repeatedly called me to tell me to STAY AWAY from her son because the caste and "cultural" differences would never work and that they would never accept me into the family. They refused to even meet me and talked crap behind my back to my boyfriend, blaming me for taking him away from family responsibilities and blaming me for my boyfriend not being able to see his grandmother before she died. The kicker on top of all this was that his mother called me and told me that it was a SIN for her son to marry me because we are of different castes. She said she quoted it from the Bhagavad Gita.

I used to try to justify their actions and think they would come around, but no more. To me, these people don't even have a heart to unharden.

While the column talks about an Indian male and a Caucasian. There are other dividing labels that I've seen or experienced that act in hindering relationships such as: gujrati vs. punjabi, sikh v. hindu, jat v. bania, pappa v. jat, catholic v. hindu, or rich v. poor. Families often have an "ideal" mate in their own minds for their children based on their own experience. For example, where the families are more culturally alike, their is a belief that the kids will be able to relate to one another better. It's understandable, therefore, for these families to have some type of shock when a child brings home someone that doesn't fit into their archtype of what they considered ideal. In some families there is legitimate concern as to whether the marriage will last. They start to predict based on what they've seen and that causes more angst and heartache. Some of it, as some of you have alluded, is based on ego, carrying the baggage of what the community will say if my child marries so and so. I've found the ego issue to be more pernicious than the initial shock or worry a family may have over whether a marriage can last.

At the end of the day, the young man needs to ask himself a couple of questions, will he regret not being with this woman if the reasons for not marrying her are not his own but are based on his family's expectations? What will that mean to his own family relationship should he make that sacrifice? Will it cause him to be embittered and angry towards them and does that in turn mean he's lost love with both his family and his woman? If he were to go forth and marry this woman, he has to ask himself, is he willing to accept a certain amount of disapprobation and realize that it's not his or his wife's fault? Lastly, is he willing to be honest with his wife and make the compromises and sacrifices that are required in any marriage?

I've seen people answer these questions differently and I can't fault them for how they wish to answer it. I don't think that there is a one size fits all answer. For those who were successful in their personal lives, the one thing that did seem apparent to me was honesty. Being honest to yourself and your loved ones. It's something that seems evident in Project 37's post. I also agree whole-heartedly with Kali, that a bit by bit patient approach is a wiser course. But at the end of the day, one has to make a decision. If after a significant amount of time and nothing has changed, one can't use the process of bit by bit in putting off a decision and hope someone comes around. He's going to have to answer his own questions and make a step in either direction.

I also feel a sense of embitterment from my girlfriend

Just make sure she doesn't start clinging to guns as a result.

Oh if I had a dollar for every time I heard a parent tell their kid they'd "disown" them if they married out. Please I have muslim and hindu friends married to each other who went thru years, one couple a decade, of hell only to get married, without blesslings, have kids and then it's a huge non issue. What a crock of shit. You make your kids lives miserable for a decade and now that they have given you grandchildren you are suddenly fine.

What seems clear to me at my age 'make it work' like Tim Gunn says...may not have been so clear at 25 and right now it's only experience that tells me "the parents will come around and everything will eventually work out". The problem is you lack that experience at 25 and it's devastating to not have the two important parts of your life jive. I can't even imagine the amount of stress this has caused.

I've also seen a different outcome from experience. The guy keeps trying to convince or hope the parents accept the outsider and it goes on for years and years and years and then eventually the girl realizes she's given him all her 20s and as soon as she enters her 30s she dumps him and moves on. And he finally marries the girl the parents pick out and his parents prediction that "he will eventually come out of the stage" comes true! I know a judge from Chicago and a Surgeon from NYC that went this route. Both left non Indian girlfriends of 8+ years burnt and angry in the process only to marry the "perfect" girl the parents picked.

I somehow never understood and always found it amazing that my friends who were perfect children and perfect human beings (in my eyes) had parents that were so cruel to them. I was blessed with a mother who thank god never ever once said something dumb like "You will see my dead face if you marry him" or "You will end up alone and without a familiy if you marry her" as my friend's parents had. That I ended up in a marriage most people think was "arranged" is just ironic.

I'll take it further though. I know couples where they married according to the wishes of the parents but the parents won't allow them to move out and live their lives and build a marriage and treat the guy like he's 12 and the girl like she's a slave!!!

I agree with you Janeofalltrades...both on the level of cruelty that parents can inflict and on the number of guys that will fool around with whoever they want in their 20s only to marry a girl their momma hand picks out for them.

This seems similar to the most commented Sepiamutiny post of all time. (Only getting its cache for some reason)

Would it be possible to create a system to score the comments (similar to slashdot or something simpler?) and / or post what you feel where the most insightful (or incite-full :-) ) comments from the post?

I predict 400 comments!

Let's not forget the "hand-picked" marriages that result in infidelity and divorce within a few years.

As I said to an India-based aunt and uncle that called internationally to tell me I was ruining the family name and that I couldn't "come home" if things ever went awry between me and him because he wasn't Indian (as though, somehow, I'd ever associate people I'd seen 6 times in my life as my lifeline if things started to fall apart): "So, you'd rather have me divorce someone from the same language and caste than be happily married outside of the community?"

Prudie's advice is spot on. Her advice, transposed to India, is still effective.

I am a southie that married a northie and, as some of you know, it can be as disparate as sambar and parantha. We met in 84, in the first year of our Ph.D. She was in a northie university and I a southie university. We dated through letters, phone-calls, conferences and symposia. Our field of study was similar and we attended every conference/symposium that the UGC (University Grants Commission) allowed. It was their money!
Four years later, we decided to get married. By this time I had met her parents a few times. I told my parents and gave them her phone number. They would not call her parents since they did not want a northie daughter-in-law. Her parents did not want to make the first move since they were not too keen to see me as a son-in-law. Both sides were caught up in stereotypes of each other. We tried to talk them out of it and attempted to get them to communicate but, no luck. We decided to elope, as soon as she submitted her thesis. She was close to writing her thesis and my experiment had another year of data acquisition.
As soon as she submitted her thesis, 6 months later, I decided to take one last chance to get the families to talk. During one of the holidays, I went to her home told her parents that I was taking their daughter to my home to meet my parents. My parents came to the train station to pick us up, shocked that I brought her. They were also concerned that her family would be very worried about their daughter, visiting us a thousand miles away. As soon as we got home, my mother made the phone call to assure her parents that their daughter would be treated as her own. After that the communication lines opened and the marriage date was was set six months later.
Now, years later, one son likes sambar and the other paranthas.

my parents didn't freak out as much as i expected....

I don't know...this guy needs to grow a pair. Seriously. All the suicide and disownment threats amount to nothing. Really. My own parents realised a long time ago that they can't expect me to be independent and hold my own job and yet strictly follow their way of life. They'll get over it.

I think it is important to understand where the parents are coming from. I don't think any parent is intentionaly trying to be cruel to their kids, they are a product of their environments and for what it is worth it is a difficult decision for them as well.

so how about the reverse situation: indian-american girl and white boyfriend?

When the girl is desi in the west, sometimes her family does more then disown her.

29 · umber desi said

I think it is important to understand where the parents are coming from. I don't think any parent is intentionaly trying to be cruel to their kids, they are a product of their environments and for what it is worth it is a difficult decision for them as well.

Give me a break...these parents know EXACTLY what they are doing. My boyfriend's mother is a manipulative b$*$&! who calls me from her son's phone to tell me to stay away from him because she knows I will pick up when I see his name. She has lived in this country for more than 10 years, lives in a metropolitan area and works for a huge, diverse company. She told him straight out that our marriage would humiliate them in their precious Telugu society. They don't give a crap about the happiness of their kids!

Kohlgirl,

I am not trying to discount your experience, I am trying to understand the parents' motivation to act the way they do. My girlfriend in Indian Catholic and both sides of parents have been very welcoming, there have been no issues at all not to say other people don't face issues, that is why important to understand what the cause of such issues are so that an effective middle ground can be found.

I think it is important to understand where the parents are coming from. I don't think any parent is intentionaly trying to be cruel to their kids, they are a product of their environments and for what it is worth it is a difficult decision for them as well.

I agree. I definitely can respect their apprehensions and their pain but everyone is an adult here and if a guy or girl are in love with someone and want to spend the rest of their life with the person I'd think it would be worth it for them to make the effort to get the parents to understand and not feel at their mercy.

Wouldn't the same parents expect them to be successful in other areas of their lives? I know it's not the easiest thing but I have a serious problem with what I have seen people lacking the ability to speak up as adults in front of their parents at 30. If you can't stand up for what you believe in at this age with your kids may as well marry someone they want you to.

Honestly I've seen parents behave in the most disgusting manipulative and knowing fashion to get what they want, control of their children and for the same parents/children it doesn't end when the kid gets married either.

JOAT,

I absolutely agree, I am 33 and I have friends around my age and I have seen them lying about stupid things to their parents.

I think there's a little bit of a control issue here too. In many cases, it doesn't matter whether all things are equal or not. Parents sometimes find it difficult to accept that you chose someone they didn't pick out or short-list for you. "Different religion", "different cultures" are just excuses for "we didn't have a say in your choice". My parents had a hard time digesting that fact until they actually MET my then-boyfriend. Once they met him and were satisfied that he was a 'nice young man', it was peaches and roses all the way.

I don't think any parent is intentionaly trying to be cruel to their kids, they are a product of their environments and for what it is worth it is a difficult decision for them as well.

intention & environment? since i was not in a totally (though FAR LESS EXTREME) situation as the slate letter-writer perhaps i sympathize with him more...but, our parents made the choice to immigrate and raise their children in this country and this environment. of course they couldn't deny the economic & educational opportunities, but it really would have been more adult of them to have thought about the environment they were raising their children in. within the first generation of the eastern european jewish experience most of the children had fallen away from observant judaism. this makes sense since the children no longer were raised in a jewish environment, where secular people were themselves ethnically jewish.*

* many polish cities were overwhelmingly jewish, and a substantial number originated from rural communities dominated by jews.

Hi All,

my last relationship was with a non-indian woman & so is my current relationship. i truly believe it is best to be honest upfront with the desi family. this is in the interest of all parties. of course, it also helps, if the family is supportive from the get-go. i have been very fortunate in this regards.

the other important factor is how close is the non-indian party of the relationship with his/her family. if close, he/she will grasp the family dynamics better & understand where the indian bf/gf is coming from with regards to their family & parents viewpoint.

i do believe in moving on & not getting emotionally blackmailed, if any set of parents create problems. it is not worth getting emotionally exhausted. what matters is whether one is happy in the relationship or not. life needs to be enjoyed.

Thanks.

PS: i enjoy the SM blog!! it has been a constant since my peace corps yrs.

This is what I am trying to understand, like I mentioned I am DBD and my parents are in India and have been very supportive of my choices. I am trying to understand how this situation may be different for some ABDs. I agree that the parents chose to immigrate to this country but those must have been hard decisions, I am no expert on why people make choices they do but I strongly believe it is important to understand the parents’ end of the story rather than dismissing it.

it is not worth getting emotionally exhausted. what matters is whether one is happy in the relationship or not. life needs to be enjoyed.

...but that's a normative judgement. totally intelligible to most americans, but not always such a slam dunk with parents who are more concerned with what others (and means those in their peer group) will think, and how the connection will affect the family. that being said, in my own experience is that if it is a fait accompli that means parents will have to reconsider their values and why their kid turned out the way they did.

I absolutely agree, I am 33 and I have friends around my age and I have seen them lying about stupid things to their parents.

just curious. are you and your chums single and looking for the perfect other? :-)

i'll tell you where i'm going with this. i've recently become familiar with festinger's dissonance theory - or why smart people knowingly do wrong things and continue doing the same despite all the warnings signs and feedback they get. as i stroke my tondh and scratch my dari ponderously, I cant but help think that MAY be the 'rents are right and all the angst is just about 'the parents are so old and old-fashioned. they CANT be right. All my single friends, including the one who's mooching smokes off me right now, must be right. No?'. Festinger also had some thoughts on companionship but that's another tangent.

this response so does not merit a response. [i got some tax paperwork to wrapup and am procrastinating :-)]

I'm a malayalee girl with a white husband. I think some of the previous commentors were absolutely right when they talked about dealing with the situation with honesty -- not just with your parents and family but with your significant other as well.
I met my now husband when I was 25/26 -- right around the time that my parents were really starting to put the pressure on about marriage. When we were just beginning our relationship, my parents started giving me the numbers and emails of guys -- I hadn't told them about my boyfriend. At the time, I wasn't sure where our relationship was going but I knew that I wouldn't be able to date or talk to anyone else. So I decided to tell my parents -- I explained that we had met, that I didn't know how serious the relationship was but that I couldn't start talking to someone else -- malayalee or non-malayalee -- because I was in a committed relationship. My parents were incredibly angry at first. They wanted to meet him right away -- so that weekend we drove down from New York to Virginia and spend a weekend with my parents. That weekend (now legendary amoungst our group of friends -- my dad asked me if he was going to marry me over dinner the very first night--we had been dating for a couple of months) wasn't comfortable, it was filled with awkward silences and nervous giggles -- but, to my parents credit, they never mistreated him.
We got married about three and a half years after that initial meeting -- throughout that time, my boyfriend and I would go down for family events and thanksgiving and everything. It wasn't always comfortable or even easy -- but these things take time. I think it's unrealistic to expect people to suddenly love each other immediately -- it takes time to build relationships, time to become comfortable with one another. Sometimes acceptance is the first, albeit the hardest, step but actually becoming a family is a process.
I also think that sometimes we hold back from telling our parents things because we are afraid of their reactions -- but I don't think that's a reason to stop. Oftentimes, our parents will suprise us with their understanding of our situations.....granted it can sometimes take a lot of explanation and patience on our part.
So I would say be honest and be patient -- our parents might have a harder time getting there, but they will -- have faith that they will recognize that you made the right decision. My mom often says to me now that my husband and I are really well matched -- that she doesn't know to many other men that would "put up with me."

just as a note -- i have wonderful parents...as hard as what I went through was (I, of course, have glossed over a lot) they never said that they would disown me or anything and they always talked to me about how they felt and everything (it was often accusatory and berating -- but at least I knew where they stood), they also listened (even though I think I said the same things for months -- but hey, as long as they finally got it that was fine with me). So my experience was definitely made easier by the relationship I had with my parents even prior to meeting my boyfriend.

We had a very similar story in our family. My brother started dating a Caucasian American girl when he moved to the US but never told my parents about it for a long time. However, for some reason he chose to take her as his guest to our cousin's wedding where my aunts had figured what was going on and made frantic calls to my parents. I remember the exact day my parents knew abut my brother's white girlfriend and they were totally devastated. He was the darling of the family being the first-born, good-looking and of course going to IIT and all. My parents first reaction was to disown him and not have anything to do with him ever. It took him two years to convince them to at least meet her. They finally met one summer and spent a month together. Just when we thought things were settling down, the inevitable happened. Her parents wanted to meet my parents because they somehow got a feeling that their daughter was being taken for a ride by the Indian family. They came in and both sets of parents had a huge show-down about everything; the wedding, grand children's religion, on where they will spend their summers etc. It got to a point where my brother and his girlfriend decided to call it quits. However, after 3 years, they got back together and have now been married for 2 months now. She calls my mom and dad Attayya and Mamayya, the gult equivalent of MIL and SIL; they exchange emails, recipes and of course tips on how to celebrate the numerous hindu festivals.

I guess throughout, my parents liked my SIL as a person. They were just not very comfortable with the idea of having a different looking person around. People living in the US have some kind of interaction with people of other races and ethnicities and it is easier for us to realize that the US is not entirely like the stereotype overdose of Sex and the City. But for people like my parents who were always in India, white girls are the ones to stay away from no matter what. So like Prudence rightly suggests, it is important to create opportunities for interaction between parents and the partner. This I think will help evaluate if the dislike is purely because of the unknown factor or if there is really something bad in the person he likes which he hasnt been able to see through his love for her.

I agree very much with JOAT about this issue, in the sense that (a) the folks will get over it; (b) and memories of discord will vanish once the grandchildren come. My parents were totally traditional about this issue while we were growing up. Insisted that we (I have two sisters, no brothers) would all have arranged marriages, we were not allowed to date, to go out with our friends at night, generally they were the strictest parents in the community of Indians living in the area at the time. I went off to college, dropped out to live with my (Irish-Catholic white) boyfriend and had no communications with them for a couple of years. In response they sent my younger sister to an Indian convent college.

After a year of misery she came back and my folks realized that if they wanted to have any communications with their kids they would have to bend, and did. That year my grandfather came to visit, they all came to see me and the bf, and liked him. Both of my sisters subsequently married white Americans and my parents love, love, love their little mixed grandkids. The sister that went to the convent school married someone who is more Indian "seeming" w/r/t relatives than any Indian I know - he is the first one to pick up Desi relatives at the airport and install them in the spare room prior to the Disneyland trip:) My parents adore him and feel my sister is incredibly lucky to have him.

Was the "transition" period easy? No, especially the time when we had no communications. Did things heal? Yes, I think my folks would find it hard to imagine life, and our wonderful, weird, mixed-up family, differently now.

I commend Curry and French Fries for being a good son, but the result - cruelty to that long-time girlfriend - is pretty awful. I think he needs to let his parents know that he is grateful for them, will always love them, and will be bringing their potential daughter-in-law on the next visit so as to let them decide when they want to see him (and her) next.

One of the best things about SM to me, is when desis share experiences that are word for word so similar to my own - it so makes me feel less lonely, less weird.

For me, and many of my girlfriends, the thing is, ------ anything goes if you get old enough. Now my parents wish that I had married my former boyfriend (white) whereas when I first told them about him, it was the old "disown you" lecture. Now almost into my mid-30s they're just hoping that I'll find anyone. Whereas once it HAD TO BE a doctor, now they're absolutely into other professions. It just makes me laugh how stressed I was with the "disown" statements when I was younger and how desparate they are to get anybody for me. I could have saved myself some ulcers if I'd just realized how flimsy their threats were...
....what a horrible thing to threaten about when you don't even really mean it.

Now my parents wish that I had married my former boyfriend (white) whereas when I first told them about him, it was the old "disown you" lecture. Now almost into my mid-30s they're just hoping that I'll find anyone. Whereas once it HAD TO BE a doctor, now they're absolutely into other professions.

sounds like you're the only one growing up... ;-)

So my parents' take on this stuff:
1. You should study lots and have a great career -- everything will be great, you'll be happy, and you'll also land an amazing spouse. Said spouse will be chosen by us, with input from you.
2. Failing this, choose an Indian Hindu (preferably same linguistic community) with a great career and family values. Date this one person SERIOUSLY with the intention to marry. Do not have sex, until you're hitched.

What their kids do:
1. Told them about whoever I was seeing (2 exceptions -- did not last).
2. Dated a couple of white artsy boys.
3. One Jewish boy and family, parents began to like the idea. Very polite, nice, young man, great academic parents -- perfect match. I break up with the boy. Parents not happy.
4. New WASPy white boy. No extraordinary career prospects. Wealthy family. Host him in the desh, but think that he is just fluff. Relationship not meant to happen anyway.
5. Finally, desi boy. Awesome, great by conventional Indian standards (educated at all the right places, good prospects, south indian glitch, great middle-class family, slightly older). Parents: why don't you wait? You will meet so many smart boys like him in grad school. I'm wondering what happened to the DO NOT DATE LIGHTLY injunction. Still, not really objecting to the summer moving-in with guy (crosses fingers).
6. Brother currently dating Chinese-American. Parents buy stuff from the desh for her (as requested by brother), but keep asking, "We hope you are NOT SERIOUS. Soon you'll go to med school, where you will meet so many other nice and smart girls."
or even better:
"Your sister will likely marry someone she chooses. So you should have an arranged marriage."

Conclusion: Parents have become more accepting of the dating culture, in the hopes that some dating experience will bring children closer to the right person. Have changed stripes completely and urge kids "NOT TO BE SERIOUS and study hard." You'll meet other smart people also in grad school." Have developed a clear hierarchy of racial preference also unfortunately over the course of 5 years :(
desi hindu> white> non-muslim asian> everyone else

"sounds like you're the only one growing up... ;-)"

INSERT "NOT"

43 · mexicalidesi said

The sister that went to the convent school married someone who is more Indian "seeming" w/r/t relatives than any Indian I know - he is the first one to pick up Desi relatives at the airport and install them in the spare room prior to the Disneyland trip:) My parents adore him and feel my sister is incredibly lucky to have him.

awwwwww! that is the extent of my eloquence in response.

42 · Never Mind said

My brother started dating a Caucasian American girl when he moved to the US but never told my parents about it for a long time. However, for some reason he chose to take her as his guest to our cousin's wedding where my aunts had figured what was going on and made frantic calls to my parents.

this is pretty daring. the one thing most desi parents (even if they're cool with whoever you're dating) want is family to not to know that offspring have a dating life, not at least until they are engaged.

I got lucky though - I think my much older male cousins paved the way for me somewhat. One of them only got married in his early thirties, and to a girl from another state. The other is around thirty and still refusing to settle down :/ My eldest female cousin married an Indian guy, Malayalee, of her own choosing, and her parents at first threw a whole ruckus about it because they "didn't know who is family was". Even my 13-year-old self struggled to understand that concept.

Any gay South Asian have experience introducing a white partner to the the parents?
Was it like Disown 2.0?

It seems like many of these stories - Never Mind's, Project 37, xetra's, sandhya's and others - carry the common message that parents will always have some initial trauma and disappointment (heck, parents go through initial trauma and disappointment if you marry someone who doesn't have the right job, even) but if the non-desi fiancee and the "wayward" child *genuinely respect* and care for the parents, want to be in the family with them, and show compassion, empathy and understanding - the parents sense and respond to that respect and love, and come around. Often much more quickly than you expected. I've observed (and experienced, in my own family with my brother and his wife) that things really only get ugly if the parents get the sense the child doesn't really care about what they think or how they feel. That's when the feelings of natural disappointment - instead of just fading peacefully as they get to know the actual fiancee - turn into rage and permanent anger.

The lesson? If you really love and respect your parents, don't give up - as Project 37 said, be sympathetic, let them know your door and your arms are always open. AND - make sure you a fiancee who isn't just being nice to your parents to humor you. He/she has to really *want* it. Parents can spot faked sincerity a mile away and will close up like a box.

2. Dated a couple of white artsy boys.

5. Finally, desi boy. Awesome, great by conventional Indian standards (educated at all the right places, good prospects, south indian glitch, great middle-class family, slightly older). Parents: why don't you wait? You will meet so many smart boys like him in grad school. I'm wondering what happened to the DO NOT DATE LIGHTLY injunction. Still, not really objecting to the summer moving-in with guy (crosses fingers).

24 · Janeofalltrades said

I predict 400 comments!

Ok, Rahul , I hope you are calling in sick today.

53 · bess said

Girly, I'm crossing my fingers for you too. I hope he's worthy of you.

Bess, thanks muchly for the great vibes -- most days I worry whether I'm worthy of him.

Wow, there are some hard-hearted desi parents out there! Damn!

In comparison, my parents have been wonderful about this issue. While they tole me they would prefer an Indian or Asian girl (my girlfriend now is Asian Hmong), they care more about character than culture. I was a typically shy awkward desi guy and my parents were always telling me to get a girlfriend. When I finally found the courage to start going on dates, they didn't care that I was seeing white girls (it's usually white girls who are interested in me for some reason). They were just thrilled that I was dating someone. They were more concerned with the possibility of racism from white people or the girl's parents.

And yes, they constantly tell me to WAIT for marriage even though I'm 25. They think 30 would be a good age for me to get married.

I guess it would be stupid to generalize about all desi parents. We're Malayalee Catholics if that makes any difference.

I lucked in out by having my older sister clear the way for me. When my parents found out that my sister was dating a white guy in college, Dad refused to my sister for over a year. And after that, it took him 3-4 years to accept that this wasn't a situation that he could change, and that he was better off gaining a son-in-law than losing a daughter. And by the time of their wedding seven years later, they had grown incredibly close to my brother-in-law.

With me, my folks engaged in massive cognitive dissonance--they never asked who I was dating, and I never volunteered any information. I finally broke the news when my girfriend (now wife) moved in with me; by that point, I was 30 and it had been over a decade after the trauma with my sister, and they never once raised an issue. I'm not sure if it was simply the passage of time, the fact that things were different for a boy rather than a girl, or that they were simply relieved that I wasn't gay.

As I think about it, it was always my father who had an issue, not my mom. From when I was a teenager, my mom always told me, "I don't care who you marry, as long as she's a good person and makes you happy." But then she'd sometimes add, "though if you really care about my feelings, just don't marry a muslim..."

I had this issue. My husband never lied about me. He was always respectful to his parents but stood his ground "accept my wife/treat her with respect or you can't be a part of our lives." They came around.

I don't belive in all of this coddling of the parents.

But it is close to three years later, and my girlfriend has still never met my parents. I greet holidays with a sense of dread because I feel pulled in two different directions. Even when I bring her up in conversation, they quickly change the subject or just walk away. They say that my relationship is just “a phase” and that I will “come to my senses.” I also feel a sense of embitterment from my girlfriend for being completely shunned by her potential in-laws. My parents have told me that they will accept my girlfriend when we become engaged, but by then I fear that their attempt to build bridges will be too little, too late.

Wow, where was this guy when I met the Biggest Mistake of My Life back in 2000? He shows a lot of cojones and maturity for his age, certainly compared to my experience. I spent what I realize was too much time in a relationship with the same sword of Damocles over our heads too. Initially, on both sides, the parents were not happy; the difference is, over time, mine thawed and began to do the holiday thing and Christmas gift thing (much to my own surprise), whereas every holiday card I sent to his went routinely, and purposefully, ignored and unacknowledged. My experience upon meeting the 'rents (twice over the course of 5 years, once here, once there) was stony silence, monosyllabic answers as I tried to ask the most harmless questions and open questions, and tension so thick you could touch it.

Any gay South Asian have experience introducing a white partner to the the parents? Was it like Disown 2.0?

I just interviewed Manil Suri recently and asked about this (his partner Larry is white and American), and he said, back around 1981, his parents (especially his Mom) were very cool when he came out on his first trip back from the US. He said that he thought she had already intuited a lot from his letters. With his father, he didn't refer to a specific incident of Having The Big Talk, but rather, it seemed to be more understood but not discussed too much. Suri's been with Larry for 18 years now. Well done, eh?

this sounds so terribly familiar! if its not the race then its the region/ language/ religion/ caste - the reason why this guy's parents are playing the waiting game is because he is. my suggestion - don't just talk about her to your parents - its been 3 years - call her over to meet them and let them talk. if they get along, they will and if they don't - well then at least someone's happy!! and then you can always wait for them to come around.

"sounds like you're the only one growing up... ;-)"

INSERT "NOT"

Or I'm not the only one growing older...I guess my parents really want to see my baby...before they die, as they morbidly put it.

I think this whole process of dating someone that your parents disapprove of is easier if you are making a ton of money. My parents supported me in grad school and later, and I work in a nonprofit and I don't make a ton of money now...If I'd just gone straight to med school and been making a six figure salary by the time I was 28 (or on my way to doing that), there would have been less pressure.

One word: Patience. I'm 31 now and have gleefully waited my parents out on the whole marriage issue. First, I had to marry a southie, anglo-indian, catholic, DOCTOR or else I would be disowned. Then, one by one these requirements got knocked out. Now, I'm dating a wonderful, Hindu, southie woman who used to be a doctor but then came to her senses and does what she loves. they really like her and things are going great. if all else fails, wait until grandkids come into the picture. they cure everything apparently.....except sanity.

Wow, sooo many stories of people going through this. I am too... in my case, the parental opposition is from my side and the boy is same religion but from a different state background. Just plain silly to oppose this while he and I both grew up in the US...

I think Indian, er S. Asian Aunties (and Uncles to an extent), with their years of socialization in the nosy Indian community environment, are adept at playing social politics. So threatening to disown, keeping their heads in the sand, acting like the relationship will die out over time, etc. are all strategies. Because S. Asian parents seem to think they should determine their kids lives - what they study, what profession they go into, etc. For some reason S. Asian parents seem obssessed with controlling their kids - probably because their kids are reflection on them in the COMMUNITY (which I hate by the way - who cares what a dumb ignorant hatin' community thinks).

So the tactics so far seem to be: threaten to disown, argue a lot, ignore, noncooperation, and in my case, try to make the "special friend" leave you (whenever my parents have finally agreed to talk, they end up either making ridiculous demands or just being really, really rude).

>>I guess my parents really want to see my baby...before they die, as they morbidly put it.

I consider a marriage to be a success only on the day when both husband and wife play with their own (not adopted) grandchild in the presence of their child(ren). Any other outcome, regardless of reason, is a failed marriage.

Your parents wanted their marriage to be a success - can't blame them for that.

M. Nam

PS, I think that's a great point about how your parents might have given you some leeway with your dating choices if you made a lot of money.

I've noticed a lot less opposition to the doctors or other super-highly successful people I've known who marry "out". A lot of times the parents or other people well say, "They met in medical school... of course a doctor needs another person on their level." Or, "Well he's a doctor and he wanted someone that would suit him." And they somehow excuse whatever difference would have been unacceptable if the child was, for example, a software engineer or something. I saw this with own Harvard-educated doctor cousin, who was actually divorced from his first marriage with minimal gossip/finger-pointing, and seemed to have no issues marrying a girl of another religion who was a lot less successful then he is. People just gave him all this credit even if they never even met him...

I think a lot of it is about power play... the more clout you have in the community, whether by profession or knowing powerful people or being super rich, etc., the more you can get away with.

For all you people out there who are struggling to convince their parents, here is a fool-proof plan.

Scenario: Desi guy living in US, parents living in India.
This guy's 'sweetheart' happens to be a desi, but from another state, speaks different language, maybe has different religious beliefs.

Step 1: Buy a camera.
Step 2: At every social gathering, ask your friends to take a lot of pictures of you, with your female friends, who should NOT be desis. White girls, black girls, Asian girls ...whatever be it.
Step 3: Email these pics regularly to your parents, together with the obligatory new car, new apartment pics.
Step 4: Mention a lot of American (girl) names during your phone conversation with you parents, and tell the story of this one friend who married a 'gori'. Drop them a hint that you too might do this one day.
Step 5: Amidst all this, please don't forget about your real girl-friend ;)

Once you have done this, your parents will call you one fine day and tell you that they are strictly against you marrying an American girl, because that's too much to ask. Your mom will also mention "had the girl been an Indian, we would have said yes to the marriage, but American is a strict no-no."

Job done. Wait for a few months, and then break the news about your real girlfriend.

This trick works like a charm, and little modifications can render it useful in a lot of different scenarios.

66 · Accidental Enlightenment said

PS, I think that's a great point about how your parents might have given you some leeway with your dating choices if you made a lot of money.

I've noticed a lot less opposition to the doctors or other super-highly successful people I've known who marry "out". A lot of times the parents or other people well say, "They met in medical school... of course a doctor needs another person on their level." Or, "Well he's a doctor and he wanted someone that would suit him." And they somehow excuse whatever difference would have been unacceptable if the child was, for example, a software engineer or something. I saw this with own Harvard-educated doctor cousin, who was actually divorced from his first marriage with minimal gossip/finger-pointing, and seemed to have no issues marrying a girl of another religion who was a lot less successful then he is. People just gave him all this credit even if they never even met him...

I think a lot of it is about power play... the more clout you have in the community, whether by profession or knowing powerful people or being super rich, etc., the more you can get away with.

Accidental Enlightenment, I think you're right in some cases but it cuts both ways. My bf with the crazy parents is a doctor and I think for many parents with the traditional success-story kids feel a sense of entitlement from their kids...i.e. "I put you through med/grad school, I supported you to become what you are, and you repay me by marrying 'out'?".

Do what I do. Stay unmarried in your late 20s and your parents will beg you to marry any Indian. Stay unmarried in your early 30s and they will be begging you to marry even a white person. Late 30s and your parents will be begging you to marry anyone. Stay unmarried in your late 40s and they will be begging you to come out or whatever if that is the case.

OK I keed, sorta.

I read that advice column on slate too and the only thing that I thought was the guy was a pussy. If my parents did that to me, I would just ignore them. I would still talk to them, but if they gave me the silent treatment, I would just tell them to cut it off. And I know if my parents tried to cut me off, my sibling would not stand for it and vice versa.

That's another thing I want to bring up. If parents disown one kid, I think it's upto the other siblings to tell the parents that if they disown one kid, they might as well disown everyone. And that is something very few Indian parents are willing to do. So my advice to any fellow Indians - ABDs or DBDs - out there is to band with your brothers and sisters and even friends and ask your parents to cut out the nonsense or ask them why they left India(where they probably will be out of place anyway after all the changes in recent years).

66 · Accidental Enlightenment said

PS, I think that's a great point about how your parents might have given you some leeway with your dating choices if you made a lot of money.

I've noticed a lot less opposition to the doctors or other super-highly successful people I've known who marry "out". A lot of times the parents or other people well say, "They met in medical school... of course a doctor needs another person on their level." Or, "Well he's a doctor and he wanted someone that would suit him." And they somehow excuse whatever difference would have been unacceptable if the child was, for example, a software engineer or something. I saw this with own Harvard-educated doctor cousin, who was actually divorced from his first marriage with minimal gossip/finger-pointing, and seemed to have no issues marrying a girl of another religion who was a lot less successful then he is. People just gave him all this credit even if they never even met him...

I think a lot of it is about power play... the more clout you have in the community, whether by profession or knowing powerful people or being super rich, etc., the more you can get away with.

(Sorry for above post, posted incorrectly.)

Accidental Enlightenment, I think you're right in some cases but it cuts both ways. My bf with the crazy parents is a doctor and I think for many parents with the traditional success-story kids feel a sense of entitlement from their kids...i.e. "I put you through med/grad school, I supported you to become what you are, and you repay me by marrying 'out'?".

Personally, I would call out my parents (as respectfully as possible, of course:)) and call them out on joking about disowning and them wanting me to be open with them. However, the reality is, some parents say this and don't really mean it if the 'openness' entails owning up to things of which they do not approve. Although I am not in a relationship right now, I suffer from similar circumstances as the writer, and am constantly being told by my parents how much they don't want me to hide things from them etc and then having to hear from them comments and judgments passed on other desi kids and their behaviour. I always challenge these comments, at every chance I get, much to my parents' (and where relevant, aunties'/uncles') grief, but I think it's the only way to show them the irrationality or hypocrisy of their statements. Admittedly, I have kept more than my fair share of secrets for various reasons, and have failed to bring home anybody whom I have dated, for the sole reason that I didn't want to be with any of them long-term and there was no point in having to hear my parents' litany of comments (both when they met the guy and well after we inevitably would break off); basically, it was easier not to create a fuss over a relationship that would never last. Now, however, I would bring home anybody who was long-term potential, even if that had not yet translated into some sort of commitment in my parents' eyes. Unlike the reader, a 'white' partner would not be a barrier, as my parents would have relatively little problem accepting him (in fact, I think my parents would more easily accept a nice Jewish guy than a Punjabi one). But my biggest fear is that I find my soul mate in a Muslim. I would still bring him home, and hope that, as with my Muslim friends, my parents would one day accept him. But I'm not so naive to think such a thing will be easy, or even possible.

I feel for the reader, but I would suggest easing his girlfriend into his parents' lives asap. And if it helps, and this is his intention, start discussing the prospect of engagement - both in her presence and when he is alone with them. Hopefully, it will give them enough time to get to know her and they might be more receptive to this if they know how serious their son is about her.

In my experience, the white son-in-law seems to have less hangups dealing with the indian relatives than the ABD son in law and certainly more respect to his in laws than the DBD son in law.

Lotsa insights from the kids side. I want to throw in something from the parents side (sorta).

I am 1.25gen (here since junior year in college), been living in the West(US/Europe) for 14 years. Extremely traditional relationship with parents (fear & respect for dad/love for mom) - arranged marriage (couldn't get over the hurdle of my near-illiterate mom not being able to talk to my wife - if you want to call that a lame excuse, I can see that POV).

I have been a dad for 18 months and have been doing some idle thought exercises about what the today's me would do if my son from 2040 wants to marry a non-Hindu. No matter how much I try, I can't get myself to accept that it is an okay scenario.

I somehow feel the responsibility/obligation to continue my Indian/Hindu way of life through my off-spring. I don't have any hangups about north-south or caste (my parents were very non-traditional on this one aspect, I don't know why) or even gay/lesbian issue (living in the West for so long helped with that I think), but I just cannot get myself to accept even the hypothetical scenario of my son/future-daughters marrying a non-Indian or Indian-non-Hindu. I feel as if that is somehow letting a piece of my own soul slip-away.

I want the resources of my kids, their kids, and so on to go towards building, enhancing, strengthening, rectifying the Hindu/Indian way of life (note the use of rectifying - don't come at me with 'is Hinduism so worth preserving?' garbage). I feel that them marrying someone outside of Indian/Hindu dharma will comrpomise their loyalty - if not theirs, their kids' loyalty will definitely be not tied as much to Hinduism.

Thoughts?

Oh, haha - I just remembered another tactics parents use. Mainly from mother: "Every since you told me I've started having hypertension/back problems got worse/dil ki bimarri." (Dil ki bimari = heart problems, not to be confused with tutte dil = broken hearts, which is what they're causing.)

When my mom tried that one, I reminded her of her yogic stress management class; "Remember to just let go with the things you can't control in life."

The drama....

And I agree a lot of getting parents to come around is to just cut through the bakwaas/b.s. and move forward. If the guy in the letter wants to get engaged, I agree he should just go for it. My parents turned around from outright rejection to reluctant and defeated acceptance of my partner choice once they saw the ring.

kohlgirl, no worries... I can definitely imagine that scenario happening too, where the parents do the whole guilt trip/I'm so betrayed after all we've done for. If the parents want to change your mind, they'll try it all... And they probably truly feel that way too. So I guess it's either tactics of real feelings.

On the positive side, if someone in this type of situation hasn't thought through about how serious, committed and ready they are for the relationship/marriage, going through these sorts of trials will definitely make them think and re-evaluate.

p.s. Sorry to everyone for the typos and grammatical errors in my post - me no good at typing/grammar

Gruhasthu, I understand your feelings about wanting to perpetuate the Hindu dharma in your offspring. But in some ways, with Hinduism, we're supposed to go with the karmic flow right? And not have attachment to a particular outcome? Do without doership, etc.? Well, that's one school of thought at least. There's also the good work = good fruits school of thought in Hinduism, which always gets very confusing when you try to reconcile the different philosophies.

So if you raise your children to have a deep appreciation of Hinduism, to find its deeper meanings and their own connection to it, maybe all you can do is hope for the best and let nature take its course. It's important to do that outside of the surface, "I gave the temple $1000 so we will get many blessings now."

Sorry for the off-topicness... but I think despite religion any parents needs to realize for their own sake that you do the best you can with raising your child. You can't expect they'll do the right thing, and you can't get so wrapped up in how they reflect on you that you care more about appearances.

i think the guy should take ownership of his life. we all struggle w/this to some extent, and a good friend reminded me that there comes a time in life when you have to simply decide how much your parents' approval is going to dictate your life. my parents, as modern as they are about certain things, are still a bit stiff about relationships. through my experiences, i've learned that my parents are just plain uncomfy with the concept of dating. whether the guy is indian or non-indian doesn't matter; whether or not the relationship is headed for marriage does matter.

parents may do and say things that hurt us, but their ultimate goal/wish is for their kids to have a happy and drama-free life. another thing about parents like these is happiness is always something in the future. they'll never be completely happy, and if this upsets you, you'll always be seeking their approval and living your life in ways that make them (and maybe you) happy, thus allowing them to disrespect you and your partner. so, while we can't change hearts and others' definitions of happiness, we can change the way we react to them.

As a white guy married to an Indian woman, I will say it took some time for the family to warm up to me. I found some of their hesitancy understandable. For instance, they were concerned I would not understand what it is like to be a minority and that I would not want to do any traditional Indian things. I think they were also concerned about what to tell the family back in India. But, there were other concerns I found a little insulting. There was a real suspicion about my motives and questions about why I was interested in someone who was not white.

They never suggested disowning my wife though and they did come around to liking me. There is still some level of distrust but we get along fine knowing that I will never be someone they confide in or discuss real feelings with.

I can see why people would be hesitant to embrace inter-racial marriage. On the other hand, we see it as something to celebrate. We do not really think about the differences of race within our relationship. In our minds, we are the same as one another, two human beings in love. But, we do have to keep aware of the fact that we both grew up with different experiences because of our skin colors and our names, etc.

On top of the personal fact that we just love each other and want to spend our lives together, I think inter-racial marriage is a testament to the human spirit and a sign of social progress that should be celebrated.

gruhasthu, i think it is possible to carry on the desi culture without being with a partner who is also desi. i think what matters is ho much your partner is open to this, or just open to the idea of culture, of whatever ethnicity. this is esp. so since there are plenty of desis - dbds and abds - who either not very tied to or knowledgable about desi culture. as a person who is an abd but also very tied to my desi culture, i think i know enough about my culture to pass it on to my kids, and i would only want/require that my partner be open to exposing the kids to the culture.

and not to nit-pick, but it seems that you have sort of mapped out your kids' lives and ambitions vis-a-vis the desi culture - it's all well and good to expose them to it, but don't get too disappointed when they don't take to it. as one of three siblings, the relationship that we each share with desi culture, despite almost equal levels/nature of exposure.

my parents, being consummate bong cosmopolitan types never objected to my marriage (they actually loved it that i married a jewish girl); my in-laws on the other hand.....needed to be convinced, to put it mildly (they had all sorts of unfounded preconceptions, etc.)

as one of three siblings, the relationship that we each share with desi culture, despite almost equal levels/nature of exposure.

...is vastly different.

i forgot to mention (#80) that its all good now

It really is an age thing.

And parents opinions change once a lot of those perfect looking marriages fall apart.

Gruhasthu-

Please don't take offense, but my first thought is I feel sorry for your kids. You said you would feel a piece of your soul slipping away and that's where I think you're wrong to begin with...its not your soul, its theirs and its not your life. You may have brought them into this world, but your kids don't owe you anything (although they should take care of you, respect you, etc.)

The second thought is, and again please don't take offense, but really, how religious are you? I have met very, very few first generation desi-americans who have even read from the Gita let alone the other Hindu scriptures. And if you are very religious and preserve your Hindi identitity by observing puja frequently, then honestly, you should know better...Hinduism is one of the great religions because of its capacity to embrace other religions. No Hindu priest I have ever spoken with has said it is a sin to practice another religion or to even marry outside the Hindu religion.

"I gave the temple $1000 so we will get many blessings now."

my mother gave up meat on two days of the week in the hopes that my sister would get married. her last trip to india started with a sojourn to guruvayoor, where the priest told her to visit 13 additional temples, which took over a trip that lasted all of 15 days. a pooja done for the same purpose two years ago resulted in very little (except, much to my mother's dismay, with my cousin becoming pregnant). a pooja last fall is the most recent event, in which, apperently, i was included, as well. not that i'm complaining about the last one - amazing kozhkattais in the prasadam ;) my mother has marriage on here mind, yet, still, despite the nearly 10 years they have spent looking for my sister, they are still extremely picky.

So apparently there are a few ways to mitigate the risk of being disowned or getting grief from parents:

1. Wait till you are past 30 and all the "requirements" and "demands" get knocked down and they are grateful anyone will marry you.
2. Fall in love with a doctor or someone making a shit load of money and it'll be easier t