July 17, 2008
A Tale of Two ComediansTV
Hari Kondabolu, who is kind of a friend of the Mutiny’s, is going to be on Comedy Central Friday night at 10pm eastern (“Live at Gotham”). Here is a snippet that I think is from the show:
Pretty clever, no? (It helps if you are a child of the 80s…)
Compare to Papa CJ, who was eliminated tonight from the NBC show Last Comic Standing, after a truly disastrous performance. I wouldn’t ruin your day with a link to that footage even if it were available, but here is Papa CJ doing somewhat similar material in London, albeit much more effectively:
In London he seems much more confident, though I have to admit I’m still not thrilled with his shtick. Is it just me, or is Papa CJ just not that funny?
That said, one does have to give him credit. It’s one thing to be a brown comic with a funny name, but a familiar American accent and a shared set of cultural reference points with one’s audience (i.e., Hari Kondabolu and Back to the Future above). Papa CJ, born and raised in Kolkata, has to work across a yawning cultural divide when he performs in the U.S. It makes comedy quite difficult (the “bollocks”/ “bullocks” joke, only marginally funny in England, would be suicidal in Los Angeles).
Ironically, due to the colonial legacy, England is probably a bit easier going for an Indian comedian.
amardeep on July 17, 2008 10:58 PM in TV · T·r·a·c·k·b·a·c·k address · Direct link · Email post
I don't think his act will be that popular outside of a very niche audience in Manhattan/Brooklyn & SF. He should consider medicine.
Louiecypher, just for clarification, which comedian are you referring to?
i liked papa cj better, hari kondabolu was ok but i found my self laughing more with cj. "we can take your jobs, SITTING AT HOME" haha. but hey i'm a f**king AWSOME brit ;)
i would like to see more of hari's work - very funny stuff. papa cj has great material but it's his delivery that does not translate well. his hand gestures remind me of comedians/singers on bangladeshi tv programming (the scooping hand, the wide-sweep hand, etc). his name is also incredibly irksome - Papa CJ? what?
i loved the cross-pollenation joke though :)
Amardeep: I was referring to Kondablu. I didn't think much of CJ either.
I kinda cringed when Papa CJ said to his British audience that "you ruled us for 200 years"...true but he didn't need to go there! The rest of his routine was OK, funny in parts. I don't think he should joke so mercilessly at India's expense though, for example that half our transportation is bullocks or whatever...it feeds or reinforces notions of us as backwards idiots (even though there may be some factual truth in what he's saying). He should preserve our dignity a little better. The same jokes in front of an Indian audience (ABD or DBD) would be ok. Just my opinion.
Its just you. He is definitely funnier than your pick Hari Kondabolu based on these clips.
I thought Papa Cj has been pretty good. His mistake was not repeating the same material because the audience wouldnt know it was the same old shtick we get to see every week. But his delivery seemed a little stilted in this week's episode. The audience was not as receptive and I think it made him a little too stubborn at times with his "i dont give a crap". Also, he spent way too much time with one guy in the audience. He should have spread it around a little bit because the audience seemed to notice the tension. I thought Eliza's shtick was too middlebrow.
BUt hey, it's LAst Comic Standing. The same show NBC once did not bother to even show the finale one season and forced viewers to catch the finale on Bravo.
Hari's joke was kind of stale to me cos Time made a similar joke ten days or so ago: "Was Jesus' Resurrection a Sequel?", referring to resurrections that are part of Judaic lore. Not accusing Hari of anything: it just immediately occurred to me when I watched his skit. He probably never read the article.
CJ is okay, but he needs to work on his delivery. All that hand-waving.
I think this Papa CJ guy also participated in the Great Indian Laughter challenge (season 3). Though I am not 100% sure but his delivery sounds very very familiar.
It's you. He's funny and so is Hari. They have different styles, of course.
I don't live in England and I thought it was quite funny.
He's a comedian and overstatement is a staple of comedy. And being able to laugh at ourselves is a good thing.
LOL - I thought both were funny! But I agree CJ needs to work on his delivery - that's the part that didn't really work for me, but yeah, his content was still funny.
Hari is alright. The other guy is corny.
If he thinks "Hackney" or wtv is bad compared to Calcutta , than it must BADD, lol Calcutta is not the nicest city in india in my opinion.
No, He's right Hackney truly is a shithole!
The top guy is clever, and I like his style of comedy, laid back, looking at a "in the public eye" situation with a new angle.
for an Indian or an Indophile CJ's punches are predictable, but could have a good effect on an audience willing to laugh at itself or smart enough to pick up a joke. That's more likely to happen across the pond. In the US outside the charmed circle of classic comedians, the general sense of humour is poorly developed. Superbowl ad humour is as far as some people can get. Jay Leno at times has to stress even his obvious lines or add on gastrointestinal references to evoke laughs. I was surprised in my early days here how few people liked Groucho Marx or Johnny Carson.
But one thing is true about the abrahamic faith followers, they'll team together when deriding non-Abrahamic faiths like Hinduism, Buddhism, Shintoism, etc...
Amardeep, it's definitely just you. Papa CJ is smart and funny; he's making clever use of the fake India accent used in the Merchant Ivory films.
wait... his accent is fake?
artist versus clown. nothing wrong with enjoying some clowning from time to time. i happen to enjoy the former more. good work hari.
CJ's material seemed funny enough, but I didn't like his delivery. It seemed overly scripted and not conversational.
Couldn't see Hari's clip entirely - it kept freezing. I do like his style much better though.
Amardeep, it's definitely just you. Papa CJ is smart and funny; he's making clever use of the fake India accent used in the Merchant Ivory films.
Actually, that's his real accent. He does exaggerate it at times for comic effect (as at the end of the routine, with the bit about the Kama Sutra), but only occasionally.
Still, if you think he's funny, I'm not going to deconstruct your yuks. To each, his own.
I thought CJ was hilarious throughout the show esp behind the scenes. When they move in the house or hotel, he sees that they have running water, 24/7. He is amazed and another comedian goes "welcome to America". His delivery def needs work and like Pravin said above "he spent way too much time with one guy in the audience."
Papa CJ is funny, but he is more rude than funny. I think he overdid the pick-on-the-audience-member bit. It made me uncomfortable. Yeah there are insult comics and all they do is insult the audience. But, you know you are going to see an insult comic. I think he should have toned it down for a general audience
Anyways, I was glad to see a desi go that far. I thought he would be out way before this point. Predictably, the Americans do seem to be ganging up on the foreigners and the men seem to be ganging up on the female
he's making clever use of the fake India accent used in the Merchant Ivory films.
That's too esoteric of a joke, even if intended. The 1st golden rule in comedy is to have relatable material.
I think Cj got flustered a bit. He had very receptive audiences all the way to the finals. This audience seemed to want it safe and it doesnt hurt Eliza is a decent looking lady with a nice rack. She has a lot more safe humor material because she belongs to this culture and can joke about many shows.
OMG, Papa CJ was so annoying and insulting last night! He cornered up on one guy, and everyone could feel the tension....also during the prop round, people were so obvioulsy shocked and bored. He needs to work on his delivery like crazy......Also his"I come from the land" jokes are horrible. Papa CJ is not funny at all. I mean what he said is the kinda stuff you will hear at EVERY desi party.
You guys must check out DAN NAINAN if you have'nt already.....that is one funny guy!
BTW, here's a dan nainan (half indian half japanese= full asian:)clip:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=say9MsdpGXs
Well Sunshine, thank you so much for your kind comments!
As to everyone else, I think Hari is hilarious; I was actually at that taping and he brought the house down! I actually met him afterwards and spoke to him a little bit, what an unbelievably nice fellow. He actually referred a client to me who wanted to book me for a show, which is unheard of in this cutthroat business.
As far as Papa CJ, I haven't met the man, although I've exchanged e-mails with him... it's great to see him make the show (although of course I wish it had been me instead). I think he's got some really funny material. In general I wouldn't rip on a comedian unless you have tried this yourself... this is a very difficult job and the other thing you have to understand is that any given point when you see a comedian, he or she is still developing and growing as a comedian. We can't all be like Russell but remember, Russell's been doing it for more than 19 years now. As Jerry Seinfeld says, the number of years you've been doing comedy is what determines how good you are, and I think that's true.
Anyway, if I might toot my own horn a little bit here, here's a recent article about me from the New York Times, along with my best video clip to date, along with one of my radio bits in which I imitate Bill Clinton. Enjoy, and if you want to know more, check out my website, or e-mail me at calrocker@hotmail.com.
New York Times article
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/26/business/26flier.html?_r=2&scp=1&sq=nainan&st=nyt&oref=slogin&oref=slogin
Performance for 4500, mixed audience
http://youtube.com/watch?v=BWC83bC6Dmo
Performance for 1800 Indians
http://youtube.com/watch?v=say9MsdpGXs
Bill Clinton impression on KSAN radio
http://www.danielnainan.com/clinton.mp3
Thanks, Dan!
Not only you have class but also an amazing talent!
I'm looking forward to your clips, though I have seen you in person.
You also brought the house down!
Dan, I think you are a "lambi race ka ghoda" just like russell. Love your "clean" stuff:)
I am silent lurker here but couldn't resist putting my opinion that Papa CJ guy was horrific and to be honest embarrassing y'day. So idiot.
I gotta disagree with you there buddy...comedians are supposed to make us laugh...and be funny...if someone's not good at it then the audience is right to call him/her out on that...though of course I hear you that it's not easy and that people improve with time. I know for sure I wouldn't be good at it.
In that vid, Papa CJ is acting a lot like the actors in Hindi sitcoms, like Ensure says above about Bangla TV. Especially his posture and also the hand motions.
"The 1st golden rule in comedy is to have relatable material."
HMF you're right....that's where Iliza had the definite advantage given the audience.
They're both funny, but for different audiences. A lot of people in (Great) Britain and India wouldn't get Hari's references any more than most people here could respond to the up close and personal from Papa CJ.
Papa CJ's "joke" about ...."Your english is good" was horrible and a stereotypical response. Why is the whole question of English immediately becomes "izzat ka sawal" for Desis?? I dont get it.
Let us not forget Papa CJ's material helped him get this far. Now all of a sudden so many people are tearing him down. Ok, so he had a bad night. Every comic has one, no matter how polished he his.
Well, language is a vehicle of culture. The same language does not convey same things in different cultures (in many instances). For example the bullocks thing would not work in the US although the language is supposedly same (English). If everyone spoke C++ than it would have had absolute meaning across cultures.
The point of above is that stand up comics need to convey a message that works 'culturally' for the audience. Just being able to speak in the same language means very little.
The thing is Papa CJ was using the same jokes through out the show. He did the same bit in Las Vegas. It worked then, but not so much in LA. And,let us remember, he did beat Paul Foot.
17 · jyotsana said
The earlier audiences had no problem laughing at CJ's schtick and they were AMerican. It was just this specific audience in LCS elimination round. Plus CJ was partly to blame as he got stuck in a tonal rut with that one guy and he refused to back off. I do like his cocky demeanor which is uncommon in standup comedy. The hands gestures did not bother me.
Why do people pay money (good money) to go sit in the front in a standup comic's show and get humiliated by the comic?? Some kind of wierd human psychology at work, may be.
the sacrifice of the few for the sake of the many
Very true. And as long as Papa CJ keeps performing, he'll have the last laugh.
I think what Dan means is that it's easy to be a critic, far more difficult to actually get on stage and perform. Only those who've tried it (and I have) would truly appreciate what it takes. And also be reluctant to rip a comedian who has a bad night.
My vote goes for the sexy, witty, animated Papa CJ. He's more in tune with the audience, spontaneous and overall funny. the half breed accent helps his case. Hari seemed so dry, even in the 1:45 min clip. He looks unrehearsed, almost like he's reciting his script.
Saw Dan at the Laugh Factory awhile back, and loves me some Nainan the most. He has an uncanny way of dramatically pausing, and entertains in a non-aggressive way, that is endearing to all ages & races of all kinds.
Some may justifiably rip on Papa CJ, for he did “die” last night. But what many people DO NOT is that Papa CJ is a Hindu. He will be reborn. He might be born as their son. He might do something ( I forget what) with their wives’ boobies.
Thank you. Thank you. I’ll be here all week.
Only those who've tried it (and I have) would truly appreciate what it takes. And also be reluctant to rip a comedian who has a bad night.
Exactly, stand up comedy is extremely hard. thats why comedians do the same act over and over again, to nail that delivery down and be completely congruent with the material they say. As for comedians picking on audience people, its usually a sign of weakness on the comedians part. They're reaching for the easiest laugh..
It's "what am I gonna do?" uhh make fun of the chinese guy's accent, make fun of the indian guy as a terrorist..."
43 · RC said
I wonder why I pay the hard earned money to the masseurs for getting squeezed.
Dan Nainan San Wow!! Hari is cool, PapaCJ did not get it up.
As a man obsessed with comedians I can say that Hari is not that great of a stand up although not bad, but would be more sutiable on a fake news show and the other dude isnt going anywhere.
Have you guys seen the Danny Bhoy, the Scottish Indian version of Dane Cook? Basically a guy who has some funny jokes, but gets annoying because women usually laugh a little too loud because they think he is cute.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=y8VE9LqrpPA
As a man obsessed with comedians
Do you know what a callback is?
I checked out more of his stuff on youtube and I think Amardeep did him a disservice posting just that short clip to compare him to PapaCJ (much longer clip).
You are funny, man. The audience loves you. By the way, since Russel Peters is anglo-indian and you are japanese-indian, when you two share the stage, as you have done, the audience gets one full indian comic, right? One for the price of two....
What a a load of pretentious ignorance! Thats your hindutva jealousy showing, jyotsana. America is the world's undisputed champion in humour: movies, TV shows, standup, cartoons, comic books, satire etc.
6 · Amitabh said
I wonder if lurkers out here were told that Papa CJ (the second comedian) were a Punjabi rather than a Bengali, would that have an impact on people's perception of him?
Hari was OK, but he was clearly nervous. He basically told just 1 joke in his 1.5 minutes. Papa CJ was wittier, and funnier. He could improve his work by adding more stuff to it. I love his reference to cross-polination and how the sun never rises in the UK.
What do you mean by annoying? This guy is frickin hilarious. I just checked him out for the first time and I must say Danny Bhoy has star potential. There is nothing indian in his schtick though; nor does he look, talk or act indian at all. He is billed as a scottish comic and thats the role he plays. Very vey well indeed!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1uOEMJSPE0I&NR=1
So Papa CJ is also a half breed? That figures. He sure doesn't look like a bengali. He should probably make some self-deprecating jokes about his huge hooked nose and skinny physique to pad his repertoire :)
Part-indian standup comedians seem to be doing much better in their profession than full indians.
Dude, Danny Bhoy is one of the biggest comics on the UK/Australasian circuit - his gigs almost always sell out. And yes to my knowledge he hasn't done any desi related material.
Um, no, it's probably even. Unless you can show me the numbers (or give me more than 2 names) that prove otherwise. In NZ we've got Tarun Mohanbhai, in the UK we have Paul Sinha, Sanjeev Bhaskar started in a comedy duo and in the US, a bunch of comics who made up Indian Invasion.
Also, hitting the big time is about one part talent, one part hard work and one part sheer luck - gotta have all three.
Also, hitting the big time is about one part talent, one part hard work and one part sheer luck - gotta have all three.
It's also about having a unique voice. When the first minority comedians came out (excluding black folks) they all did immigrant, family humor (started by, say, Margaret Cho). Now people are getting smart (sort of) and realizing there's such a thing as a ""-American. But in the end, your comedy has to be unique and personal, especially when you start out, if you stick to "current" stuff, your punchline is usually already milked by the time you have a chance to get it out there.
I worked on the "Last Comic Standing Semi-Finals", and Papa CJ was not funny, to me as an Indian or the rest of the crew who were mostly Caucasian. Seemed like he was trying too hard and from what I remember he was a bit crude, which isn't always necessary to be funny (ie Dan Nainan, Rajiv Satyal...)
Here are some more Indian stand up comedians you may like: www.indianinvasioncomedy.com.
Why isnt he big in America yet? He is a comic genius. Definitely my favorite comedian from now on. That he is half desi is just icing on the cake.
I let the "Live at Gotham" pass since I wanted to contribute to the record breaking opening for the story of the other Gotham city that was released on Friday.
Thanks Amardeep. The first time I heard about Hari Kondabolu was at Sepia Mutiny. I checked out his stuff at Youtube and now I'm a fan. I agree about Danny Bhoy being funny as well.
@Kaka. He's half desi. I read an article a while ago about him with this title "Danny Bhoy defies heritage to be a comedy purist". Um..no. He does make jokes about being Scottish so one side of his heritage does impact his comedy.
I'd take both of them over Russell Peters any day.
30 · Dan Nainan said
As to everyone else, I think Hari is hilarious; I was actually at that taping and he brought the house down! I actually met him afterwards and spoke to him a little bit, what an unbelievably nice fellow. He actually referred a client to me who wanted to book me for a show, which is unheard of in this cutthroat business.
As far as Papa CJ, I haven't met the man, although I've exchanged e-mails with him... it's great to see him make the show (although of course I wish it had been me instead). I think he's got some really funny material. In general I wouldn't rip on a comedian unless you have tried this yourself... this is a very difficult job and the other thing you have to understand is that any given point when you see a comedian, he or she is still developing and growing as a comedian. We can't all be like Russell but remember, Russell's been doing it for more than 19 years now. As Jerry Seinfeld says, the number of years you've been doing comedy is what determines how good you are, and I think that's true.
Anyway, if I might toot my own horn a little bit here, here's a recent article about me from the New York Times, along with my best video clip to date, along with one of my radio bits in which I imitate Bill Clinton. Enjoy, and if you want to know more, check out my website, or e-mail me at calrocker@hotmail.com.
New York Times article
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/02/26/business/26flier.html?_r=2&scp=1&sq=nainan&st=nyt&oref=slogin&oref=slogin
Performance for 4500, mixed audience
http://youtube.com/watch?v=BWC83bC6Dmo
Performance for 1800 Indians
http://youtube.com/watch?v=say9MsdpGXs
Bill Clinton impression on KSAN radio
http://www.danielnainan.com/clinton.mp3
Dan:
I'm very familiar with you, bro! You're amazing, and your comedy is very good even for a family. So I appreciate that very much. Dan, have you ever considered being an actor? I'm sure that you'd do an amazing job there with your good looks. Heck, wouldn't it be very funny if there was a "Harold, and Kumar" comedy movie, featuring their mutual half-brother, Dan Nainan?
Keep up the good work, and hopefully, we'll see you back here in Boston really soon, buddy!
Not a fan of comedians that rely on ethnic jokes, like these guys do. Really, they are just rehashing the same old jokes. Tell me when they find the brown Larry David.
I feel the same way. But he/she's in India, not the diaspora. And their potential audience has grown accustomed to dancing midgets
62 · Darrie said
Didn't know your taste leaned towards a triple decker peanut butter sugar sammich...
Hari looks like the stereotype of a tambram computer nerd.
There are more jokes from Hari on Comedy Central site- http://www.comedycentral-q.mtvi.com/comedians/browse/k/hari_kondabolu.jhtml
I like these much more than that back to the future one.
Hari is funny, but he's not Russell Peters. Though maybe Dan Nainan is right and it's not fair to compare someone with so much more experience.
all fine comics, and also watch look out for this sikh comic:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sA8U8slkHfI
Not a fan of that "Sikh comic" as a person or as a comic.
Thanks,Ick. That's going to do wonders for my confidence. Awwwwrighty then.
i like this one from hari. it's clever. http://youtube.com/watch?v=fuzSm0cX12c
Don't pay any attention to him, Narinder. You've obviously got talent. Just keep performing and making people laugh. Maybe we'll see you on "Last Comic Standing" soon.
Seahawks Fan, thanks. My goal is to try out for “Last Comic Standing.” However, I have to workout some new material before. Stand up comedy, for the most part, is about writing and rewriting. Here’s a link to my last weekend’s show:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sZemM-2s00M
Papa CJ had no regard for the tv audience who heard him do the same jokes three times. I realize it worked at the beginning but he had to show a progression. Did he really expect to do the sucking on your wife's boobie joke everytime? ISnt he trying to build a fanbase outside of the live audience there.
why is this thread still going? anyway, i did some research.
papa cj's opinion on his last comic standing experience is on the news section of his website. reading it made me like him a million times more- http://www.papacj.com/home.htm
here is more of hari's stuff from last week's tv airing- http://www.comedycentral.com/comedians/browse/k/hari_kondabolu.jhtml
that mexican bit is really good.
I think Papa CJ is wity and clever, but I don't think his humour translates well into stand-up comedy. His stand-up is just not that funny. Outsourcing, Indian accents?? Every Indian comedian for the last 10 years has been doing the same material as him - except that when they were doing it, it was fresh. Can you imagine an hour of him?! Yikes.