As a native West Virginian, I love it when women tie rakhis on me!

It's all about sisters who are some sharp son of a guns who end up making a nifty chunk on change at the end of the day. ;)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qhasiWXqywI

Happy Raksha bandhan. TREATS!!!

Sometimes rakhis fly in unexpected directions. RSS all-men rakshabandhan is an interesting twist on the tradition.

lol @ this

"There was no way she was going to give the sparkly object and mithai to her brother in return for a promise, merely oral, not even signed and notarized."

In my house, there was an opposite effect to. My parents would give me a 20 dollar note and say give this to your sister, after she ties the rakhi around your wrist.

My response "I get this girly looking bracelet thing and she gets 20 bucks? What part of the game is that?"

Indians sold Manhattan for a bunch of beads.

Native American, please! Identity-munging terminology on this of all websites. Sho! What is the world coming to?

Is it just me or is there just a hint of "wow, this is some weird primitive thing, I dont surely dont have anything to do with it" in your post?

in my inter-faith and multi-national family, rakhi is a symbol of affection and we all share and tie them on each other without regard to gender. This is also the general direction that its taken in india - a symbol of platonic affection between between men and women - woh to hamari rakhi behen hain - and sometimes between people of the same gender.

I think if you look more closely at the foundations of Halloween - with its connection to witchcraft and head hunting - or at Valentines day - based on christian martyrdom - you might have a similar reaction. But those strange histories are mostly forgotten in modern times.

And I suspect that is going to be the case for raakki and Kaarva Chauth - with the latter re-interpreted as a festival of marital commitment.

In our Bengali family, we do this later, usually in the fall. It's actually one of the few traditions that I don't mind doing. After all, there is nothing equivalent in brother-brother relationships, or sister-sister relationships.

Native American, please! Identity-munging terminology on this of all websites. Sho! What is the world coming to?

"Indian" is the official legal term, fwiw.

We never really did the raakhi thing in our household, because it was more of a Northern tradition, and we were South Indian. (Yes, we are like that only, mind it!)

But there were similar sorts of practices, and I always thought my older brother got a raw deal. He gave me money, and all I had to do was pray for his well-being once a year. Piece of cake.

KXB

you are referencing bhai phota, which usually follows or preceeds diwali

...you are referencing bhai phota, which usually follows or preceeds diwali

There used to be a time while in Desh, when I used to be the proud guy with 30 Rakhis on my forearm.
Now, the infection control policies of the NHS mean that I cannot even go around with the 2 or 3 discreet threads that do make it across the continents.
I love the sentiments behind Rakshabandhan, and being close to my little sister, almost a 3rd parent, I specially like a formal celebration of the ties that bind.
My favourite Rakhi moment this year however, was when my only 'Rakhi sister', my best friend's wife, went out of her way to send a hand made Rakhi, and managed to get it delivered to me the day I was shifting to a new job in a new city. I reached there, stressed and lonely, unloading my packed worldly possessions, and saw a neat packet with a Rakhi, some rice, teeka and a sachet of Tetley sugar waiting for me. It put a broad smile on my face.

This is the weirdest thing I have heard about this beautiful festival! This is nothing but a celebration/strenthening of the brother sister relationship and to look at it from a gender inequality argument seems ridiculous to me.

Now now Ennis, be a sport and send some money or sweets to all your sisters. In Gujarat we have the day after Hindu new year - called Bhai Beej. This is when the sister reciprocates and invites brother to have dinner at her place - of course with permission from her husband;-) This event is Raksha Bandhan - in reverse. So let's not be cheap and shrug from our promise to our sisters that we will be there - just in case she needs us... OK.

Btw, Jyotsana, I never realised that you were a dude.
You come across as a very knowledgeable person. I enjoy reading your comments.

I agree with sunshine.This is the most weird post I ever read about Rakhi too.
Sometimes for people growing up out of India if their own nucleus family does not do something then since they find nothing happening outside in the American world they might miss the whole significance.In India their mama (mother's brother) might have come over or they might have gone over to their maasi's place ( Father's sister)
and if you step out of your home that day you cannot miss the festival with every male wrist festooned with Rakhis.
Instead of the 'lots of rakhi on hand' example given by the writer ( Though true for school boys :) They dread this day for those reasons ! ) those who have no rakhis to show on this day are usually glum about it .I know am missing tying a rakhi personally on my brother's hand today.
Festivals get reinterpreted all the time . My two daughters tied rakhi to each other yesterday night.

Yo Dad - I'm happy to send them all sweets and money, that's not the problem. I'd just like them to wear a Rakhi and promise me that they'll protect me too :) I mean, my sisters are pretty tough women!

Al Beruni - have you ever heard of a guy fasting on Kaarva Chauth?

Sunshine - if it's so beautiful, wouldn't it be twice as beautiful if it was egalitarian?

Monika - while festivals get reinterpreted all the time, have you ever seen a woman in India walking around with a wrist full of 30 rakhis? I suspect the traditional form is still pretty dominant. The only people I know doing the egalitarian version are ... ABDs who grew up outside of India and who see the holiday differently from the traditional form.

See, if I had tied rakhi on some of my sisters, they'd be here to protect me from ... this criticism :)

Ennis, equal =/= identical. You can have an egalitarian view about the worth of each gender without necessarily insisting that those genders are the same in every way.

In fact, the latter view would be kind of silly. Most prior (and sensible) forms of feminism didn't insist on saying that "women and men ought to be exactly the same," they focused on getting an acknowledgement from society that women added value to society beyond the merely ornamental and cosmetic (and this later expanded to encompass roles beyond housework.)

Take the counterfactual. What kind of society will you be living in when you don't consistently reinforce the idea that brothers have an obligation to look after their sisters? Keep in mind, we don't live in Rawlsian veil of ignorance la-la-land here. We live in the real world where there actually are gender disparities.

@Yoga Fire: Your response is revealing. Can I infer from it that you believe that men and women are not equally capable of being protectors? That one gender is better suited to that role, and the other to being protected?

Note that I didn't call for a world where brothers ignored their sisters, just for a separation of protection from gender. As I said to Sunshine, if this holiday is so beautiful, then wont it be twice as beautiful when men and women can play both protector and protected?

then wont it be twice as beautiful when men and women can play both protector and protected?

take your roleplay ideas to that dirty craigslist.

"I suspect the traditional form is still pretty dominant."

Traditionally, the only way people heard about what is going on each others life was by physically meeting with each other. So, you can also interpret traditional form of Rakhi as an occasion to talk\meet\catch up your sister. I guess you get taught about all this "brother suppose to protect sister" thing at some point but that is not how most people I think about it. Reason: Sisters who are not able to tie Rakhi probably do not miss Rakhi because they worry that brother won't protect them anymore.

Anyway, you are mixing things up .. what has Rakhi got to do with female-male equality?

I have some really nice memories attached with Rakhi. This is the day when all my moms brother will come over to our house, along with cousins and we will have a great time toghether.
Now I am here in LA and my sis is in a different city and life has taken us into our own busy directions. But this day provides us a chance to renew the bond and celebrate it, and I absolutely love it when I find the rakhi in the mail.

I am sorry but I find you take on it kinda weird, and not even that funny.

I meant "mom's brothers". My dad is not such a stud ;)

I am no ABD, but DBD. Growing up we too made the usual protests/arguments about the sexism in this festival ( and in all the others too Diwali,Karwa Chauth just name it and I can present those :) We were invited to interpret it as we wanted.
. So we settled for this - while I would tie the Rakhi on my brother ,we both would get the moolah from our parents .Never really bothered much about the protection aspect.( That's just the origins of the festival ..dates back to Rani Padmini times and older ) Our focus was more on the Cadbury chocolates !
What riled me while reading the post is the wondering on the 'why' of the festival and its reason. Rakhi is much more than that.It's a lovely festival which connects brothers and sisters year after year specially as adults when they move away and get absorbed in their own families.

Happy Rakhri

I miss this festival. I remember my mom's excitement as she prepared to visit her mom's home for Rakhi - home cooking and everything. I do not have a sister so whenever we lived away from our extended family this day (especially the evenings) use to be pretty joyless. We are two brothers and even amongst cousins (12 of us) we had 'just' 2 girls. These girls accumulated quite a bit of dough on Rakhi day.

These days people send each other Rakhi cards and oraganize Rakhi Parties with DJs and all that. I am not sure it is that much fun.

Upbhransh: I will get Rakhi in mail - these days one of my 'cousin-sisters' is in US so I will get 'Kaju Barfi' too. :) -it is not the same though tying rakhi with one hand is not fun.

Aren't any of you concerned about the messages you're sending your daughters?

People tell me that Karwa Chauth is a wonderful celebration of "marital commitment" but in the end, it's the woman who goes hungry to ensure the man's health and not vice versa. It doesn't show that "spouses" should sacrifice for each other, it shows that the role of the woman is to sacrifice for her husband, but the husband has no reciprocal obligation to sacrifice for his wife at all.

Similarly, rakhi isn't about siblings and friends promising to protect each other, it's about brothers protecting sisters, males being told their role is protector and females being told their role is to be passively protected. When gender roles are one way, you're not just sending a message of obligation to the males, you're sending a message of passivity to the females.

Think about a 15 yr old girl tying a rakhi on her 4 yr old brother, and being told by her grandfather that this means her 4 year old brother will "protect her" now simply by virtue of being the male. Even though the girl is both older and bigger, and the boy is not able to cross the street on his own, she's the helpless one to be protected and he's the strong able warrior to protect her.

This reminds me of the time when the voice boxes got crossed between GI Joe and Barbie. The barbie doll said "Math is Hard!" and if anybody had criticized that they would have been called shrill. Defenders would have said that math is hard, and Barbie was merely being sympathetic and encouraging. But when GI Joe started to say "Math is hard!" nobody made that excuse, everybody would see how wrong it sounded coming from a man, and therefore how Barbie was sending messages of helplessness.

Aren't there ways for siblings to celebrate their bonds without reinforcing pernicious gender stereotypes of female helplessness? Are rakhis so ugly that no woman wants to be seen wearing one? Does it make a woman any less feminine to be seen as a protector?

Your response is revealing. Can I infer from it that you believe that men and women are not equally capable of being protectors? That one gender is better suited to that role, and the other to being protected?

I have yet to hear a lady protest when I hold a door for her. In the real world it is blatantly obvious which gender is expected to brave dangers on behalf of the other. I don't believe I have ever once heard a woman complain about how unegalitarian I am when I offer to walk her home at night.

There were obviously sound reasons for norms having evolved this way. Generally the feminist critique assumes that these are all the work of a patriarchy conspiring to cement their position on top and keep the womenfolk down. The anthropological perspective holds that women are, in fact, just plain more valuable to society than men are. The ability to have children and the fact that mothers tend to develop stronger bonds with their children than fathers do means the long-term viability of your civilization (both in terms of demography and intergenerational transmission of culture) hinges more heavily on keeping women safe. Safety is confining and that sucks. Modern technology and state capacity ensures that many of those issues are no longer as big of a concern, so we don't have to cloister women as much. But there is no real reason that we should just pretend the underlying realities that we developed the technology to circumvent should be forgotten.

But the main thing you're missing is that overarching cultural norms are not about the individual. They are about doing what is best for and ensure the continued thriving of the whole community. On an individual basis some people on the edges of the bell curve might not be able to fit the mold. The nice thing about flexible cultural traditions is that the fringes can modify the traditions to meet their own needs without having to piss in everyone else's cheerios. As long as those modifications are done with the purpose of participating rather that subvert them to make grandstanding theatrical statements nobody but the wingnuts get especially angry about it.

Note that I didn't call for a world where brothers ignored their sisters, just for a separation of protection from gender. As I said to Sunshine, if this holiday is so beautiful, then wont it be twice as beautiful when men and women can play both protector and protected?

Let's get working on that prolactation pill to make the world just a bit more beautiful and homogenous. Notice the use of the term "homogenous." When you not only assume, but insist on an assumption of variegated groups being identical what you're doing is imposing conformity, not egalitarianism.

I appreciate this post, and the different perspective. But Rakhi is at its base celebrating the bond between a brother and a sister, and the Rakhi offers protection from evil to the brother, while he offers protection to the sister. I think your criticism is misplaced: the sexism lies in two things: a) the sister needs a piece of thread to protect her brother, thus needs to rely on the Gods, while the brother protects her himself b) the way that society has evolved these days, gender roles have become a lot more defined; when the tradition originally started, sisters had an equal role in protecting their brothers when they went off to war, while their brother's protection helped them hold the fort (literally?) while they were at war. Personally, I think it is a beautiful tradition that emphasizes the role of family, and shows that women do not need their husbands to protect them (rather, during Karvachauth, they pray for their husbands to be safe). But I can see the potential criticisms. As a feminist, I am usually aware of traditions steeped in patriarchy, and I usually send Rakhis to my sisters to celebrate sisterhood as well :)

@desinist: Thank you

@yogafire: So you think asking a sister to protect or provide for her brother is as unnatural as male lactation? Do I have that right?
If you have a daughter, you wont teach her to hold the door for whoever is coming next? That's the traditional norm, right? Man opens the door, woman walks through it. She opens it herself if she has to, but she never holds it open for anybody else.

You're suggesting that I'll cause the end of chivalry. I think chivalry goes much deeper in a world where (like today) both men and women hold doors open for each other, depending on who came first.

Can I infer from it that you believe that men and women are not equally capable of being protectors? That one gender is better suited to that role, and the other to being protected?

Ennis - I do personally know several couples where both parties fast on karva chauth.

Indic traditions are evolving and changing. Your comments indicate ignorance of these changes.

As I said before, there is a hint of superiority in your comments, the great liberal thinker kindly tolerating weird traditions of the hindooos (in the original sense of hindu). But at the same time, I am sure you are full of enthusiasm for Halloween and Valentines day, each of which has its own peculiar history with some quite astonishing facets.

One story I have read is that Rakri actually began in Ancient Punjab when Puna ( Porus)'s wife begged Sikander ( Alexander)not to kill Porus. She tied a string around Sikander's wrist and asked him to be her brother and protector..not sure how true this is, but more likley than the myths I think

As I said before, there is a hint of superiority in your comments, the great liberal thinker kindly tolerating weird traditions of the hindooos (in the original sense of hindu). But at the same time, I am sure you are full of enthusiasm for Halloween and Valentines day, each of which has its own peculiar history with some quite astonishing facets.

I would would mostly agree with that except the "great liberal" and "thinker" part.

@Al Beruni - you're presuming a lot. You don't know me, and your inferences about my thinking and behavior are incorrect. They're also not useful - why not keep the discussion on what I'm saying rather than what you think I'm feeling and believing?

As for changes, I think the other comments here show that change, if it's happening, is both gradual and not widespread. After all, Yogafire suggests that having a sister play the role of protector is as unnatural as male lactation.

Have you ever seen a man giving rakhis to a woman? That would be the hard case for change. I've heard of men giving them to each other (the RSS) and women sometimes giving them to each other, but never a man giving to a woman. And I've been asking. If it happens, it seems to be pretty rare.

Since I've posted this somebody emailed me to say they know several couples where both fast during karwa chauth, and I think that's beautiful, but in all the cases I know -- in the US, India, and other countries -- it's only the woman. In India I got laughed at for asking about men fasting, it seemed absurd to the people I was with.

I agree with ennis on comment 35 ,

Yes in general change is gradual and not widespread where gender equality in festivities are concerned .
In many places trying to change that in small ways will lead to strict anti responses from some traditional elders and since most festivals are extended family affairs , these elders are to be found willy nilly.
I recall a family where the number of sweets in the pooja plate would be based on the number of males of the family attending that pooja.
Even questioning that was not allowed.Definitely would off putting to attend such a pooja, but festivals are not always ruined everywhere by such practices.
and Rakhi is generally not one of the rigid ones

and as for Karwa Chauth - both couples fasting is quite rapidly coming in fashion nowadays at least in Indian metros So much so that in my circle of friends ( Many in India and many here) the guy not fasting would be the one squirming in a meetup of friends! :) Since his wife will not take kindly to his not fasting for her longer life .
I guess the movies are responsible for that for eg Think DDLJ

In India I got laughed at for asking about men fasting

I think mixing Karva-Chauth with Rakshabandhan is a mistake. I know you are hinting at the common aspect of supposed male-superiority behind the two, but they are really very different in their roots and symbolism

Yogafire suggests that having a sister play the role of protector is as unnatural as male lactation

This is such a sweet post. I am surprised that people are criticizing you for throwing light on the inherent sexism of the festival. Its so refreshing to see a man question the norms. Hope you won't let the criticism affect your attitude.

@Lupus:

Al Beruni linked Rakhsa Bandan and Karwa Chauth in comment 6. I didn't bring it up originally, but they are similar in that the traditional form of behavior is one sided and I'm suggesting that in both cases the symbolism is enhanced, not reduced, by making it two-sided, and removing the element of female passivity from the equation.

And yes, gender exists, but the question is to what extent does it define social roles? Shall we exclude women from the military as inherently unfit? Or view female soldiers as freaks and stigmatize them for going against nature? How about hard charging female executives working in traditionally male spaces, such as litigators or bond traders?

This post on Rakhi would be of course adhoori (incomplete) without adding a link to the one and only rakhi song ..here...and here's the original :)

You don't know me, and your inferences about my thinking and behavior are incorrect. They're also not useful - why not keep the discussion on what I'm saying rather than what you think I'm feeling and believing?

exactly. you don't know yogafire too, and your inferences about his thinking and behavior are incorrect. they are also not useful---why not keep the discussion on what he says rather than how you can twist words around? you find sexism in what he is saying because you are looking for it---very few others here would think he is saying women being protective is like males lactating.

i am very fond of some of my (women) friends, and rakhi is one way to express it. i look to them for a lot of advice as well---to "thank" them/request them for it by tying a rakhi would, to put it simply, be amusing to them. the same symbolic gesture have different depths of meaning to different genders.

but if you do want to tie a rakhi to a female friend, who is stopping you? just don't do it only once.

on this topic, the guy ties the mangalya on the woman's neck during marriage. the hymn chanted during that is "the thread i tie symbolizes my life, live long and prosper" (ok the second part is just "live for 100 autumns"). i thought the "enlightened" reaction to that was that this ceremony was sexist too---only the guy ties the mangalya---even if he is the one who is asking the woman to be in charge of his well-being?

you can have it only one way. which one is it? the rakhi or the mangalya?

i agree with al---there is a hint of superiority here. you "know" indians are sexist, so you look for it in everything they do. if you assumed the west were sexist, you could find sexism in everything the west does as well. everything appears yellow to the jaundiced eye.

Plus the first rakhi was tied by a wife on a husband ( The God Yum's wife ( God of Death ) on his hand to protect him ) ( Think Harry Potter's mum's kiss)
Then later along the way came a smart queen sending rakhi to ask for protection and we have the current form.
So really just get along with it :) celebrate if you like it , change it if you don't but the main crux of rakhi ..siblings celebrating together ..is a lovely concept and not found easily in other cultures.

@bytewords:

I said to Yoga Fire:

if this holiday is so beautiful, then wont it be twice as beautiful when men and women can play both protector and protected?

And Yoga Fire responded:

If motherhood is so beautiful, wouldn't it be twice a beautiful when both men and women could breast feed?

His words are directly drawing a correspondence, talking about the ways in which nature shapes gender roles. I asked him in my reply if he thought that men nursing and women protecting were equally unnatural. I'm not presuming anything about whether he thinks he's superior or not, I'm just asking for a clarification of his statement.

That's very different from people assuming what I do on Valentines Day or Halloween, or claiming they know I'm feeling superior about rakhri. I'm questioning the tradition, there's no reason to claim I'm getting uppity in response. We have a rule about keeping discussions non-personal and focussed on the words, not the people.

As for mangalya, that's outside of my cultural reference. While some Sikhs do celebrate rakhri for cultural reasons (half my family does the other half does not), there is no mangal sutra at a Sikh wedding. That said, no personally I wouldn't be comfortable with that.

I am perpetually astounded by the extent of liberal re-education present on these forums. Men are in most cases far better suited to be protectors than women. There are a few women who defy this, yes, but by and large it is true. A bunch of leftists arguing that men and women are the same is completely mind-boggling. Men are better at some things, women at others. Just facts.

This whole gender argument is ridiculous. Its a case of over analyzing and looking for issues when no issue exists!There's always going to be differences between men and women..men are good at certain things, women are good at others, recognize that, accept that and be happy. Ennis, believe me, you DON'T want to be equal with women in every respect...its not always fun:)
P.S: No wonder you filed this post in the humour category...your argument is funny!

I really liked Rakhi the first time. But the whole thing went south by the time that ridiculous thing with that Russian boxer came around.

First, I must confess, I have never heard this song before, but it rocks my socks off.

Secondly, I have only recently experienced Rakhi but I think (mayhaps) that one can make it a bit less sexist by the choices of description... as opposed to "you give your bro a sparkly bracelet and he promises to protect you" you could sort of reword it as just celebrating the bonds of siblings... I have seen little girls have it tied too in India by siblings. People tied it on me (I'm a female, in case the name doesn't give it away) in a sort of affectionate "thanks for celebrating with us" kind of way as well.

I suppose it all goes to how you want to go about thinking about it. Also, I think I would much rather have money and sweets than a little gaudy bracelet... hehe

Oh.. and I forgot to mention... I particularly ENJOY the ability to tie a rakhi on a boy who is a friend... a nice way to reinforce the "I'm your friend, but don't try anything" relationship! Great really, I will we tied Rakhi in the U.S. it would really help clear up a lot of confusion in life! ;)

"Men are in most cases far better suited to be protectors than women."

Men are fair better suited for unprotecting women too (ahem....)

Ennis:

"The only people I know doing the egalitarian version are ... ABDs who grew up outside of India and who see the holiday differently from the traditional form."

The tying of rakhi on me and sisters of the family I was visiting was in India... so I don't know about everyone, but it was happening at the house I visited!

LinZi:

You're right. A number of people have now told me about the less common but not-rare giving of rakhis among females. But when I ask, people say that men giving rakhis to women (or boys to girls) is far outside the pale. Were you given a rakhi by other girls or by a guy?

I was given rakhi by a family in a sort of communal way. At the time I was living in Jaipur in a flat. My landlady/host "mother" (more of a landlady really) invited me to a rakhi celebration/birthday party with her family. I can't remember who actually tied the rakhi on me and my room mate really, but I got the sense it was a sort of communal "relationship" building from the family to us.

Afterwards, us girls went out and painted henna on each others hands... :)

I guess my point was that while the tradition is rigid (girls tie rakhi on brothers, brothers promise protection) the actual practice (at least in my experience) seems to be much more fluid.

Don't you people know anything about the glorious Indian tradition? It's a great day to destroy your foes. "Yes yes, you should tie a rakhi on him. He's looking forward to it."

since we're all sharing, it was always kinda confusing to me as I am a lot older than my brother and always protected him and looked out for him since he was born. And I've doled out more money for him than vice verse, since I always had a job and he didn't. So, I would always tie it on him with the good luck and best wishes he'd get his act together. Then, accept the gift that my mom picked up.

I like the idea of getting away from the brother/sister and really let siblings tie on each other -- let the 2 sisters tie rather than grabbing a token brother.

Desinist in #27:

This reminds me of the time when the voice boxes got crossed between GI Joe and Barbie. The barbie doll said "Math is Hard!" and if anybody had criticized that they would have been called shrill. Defenders would have said that math is hard, and Barbie was merely being sympathetic and encouraging. But when GI Joe started to say "Math is hard!" nobody made that excuse, everybody would see how wrong it sounded coming from a man, and therefore how Barbie was sending messages of helplessness.

You didn't write the full story there. It is completely true that some assholes at Mattel thought it was appropriate to make Barbie-users think that math class was tough, but the chip-switch was done deliberately by the Barbie Liberation Organization. The full story is also here at Barbie Liberation's website. The chip-switched Barbies yelled stuff like "Vengrance is mine!" and "Eat lead, Cobra!", while the counterpart GI Joes talked about shopping and clothes and weddings. This was a perfect hack: they got the point across about gender stereotypes, no laws were broken and nobody got hurt or killed, but still some wankers were outraged at these "terrorist attacks" on kids.

Raksha Bandhan is a N. Indian holiday, just like Diwali and Holi. In S. India, they don't celebrate these holidays, typically, especially in the country side. I believe that this holiday is beautiful, by the way. Muslims all over India don't really observe this "Hindu holiday" as well. Moreover, Muslims never wear kaddas like Sikhs/Hindus or threads around the wrists.

Most of my N. Indian friends are none too happy about this observance and would just as soon get shot down like everyone else (i,e. in a bar accompanied by sounds of female laughter). This is the Indian equivalent of a woman introducing the fact that she has a boyfriend apropos of nothing. Happily we Lemurians reproduce asexually, fewer people get hurt

Someone just posted a news story, Kasab was crestfallen in court that no one would tie a rakhee on him. WTF!?

As someone else mentioned before, the bengali version is celebrated later with tilak, instead of rakhi. However, while marking the tilak on brother's forehead, sisters usually recite a poem, the gist of it usually means that "with this tilak, the doors of death are closed for my brother" ( “ Bhaier kapale dilam phonta, Jamer Duare porlo kanta'), so it usually means that the tilak is granting protection to the brother. Since, my sister and I didn't have a brother, we used to give bhai-phota to our grandfathers (maternal, paternal, and neighboorhood granpas). It was soo endearing, with all the old grandpa traveling from far and wide just to make us happy. I miss them, now that they are all gone.

We also celebrated Rakhi, because it was such a sweet festival (and those rakhis were SO pretty). During Rakhi,my sister and I would tie Rakhi to each other and whichever cousin was around.

Ennis,

What you don't seem to know about Karwa Chauth is that when the wife does break her fast she is served by her husband a meal that has been prepared by him as well. That's the tradition. This is followed by lovemaking in the bedroom where wife gets to be on top! Far from being sexist this festival is actually very feminist-friendly.

As a non-hindu South Asian, I think this tradition is actually very beautiful, though I do agree with Ennis that is sexist in a way and promotes gender stereotypes. But if we focus on the sibling bond, we can make the tradition more egalitarian. Since, I don't have a sister, I wish I could tie a rakhi on my brother's wrist and he would do it on mine.

Also, in today's DAWN, there was a really heartening sentence. A Pakistani Hindu girl in Sindh said "Since I don't have a brother, I tie rakhi on my neighbor, Hassan, who is like a brother to me". Here we have a case of true inter-faith harmony:)

Prospect Bagh: so the woman can get on top, but only if she loses some weight first?

Sorry it took me so long to respond, it seems I've been barred from posting from home for some reason. . .

His words are directly drawing a correspondence, talking about the ways in which nature shapes gender roles. I asked him in my reply if he thought that men nursing and women protecting were equally unnatural. I'm not presuming anything about whether he thinks he's superior or not, I'm just asking for a clarification of his statement.

Firstly, I don't subscribe to the naturalistic fallacy. "Natural" is a fuzzy word with no real importance. While Lupus was mostly right in interpreting what I said as there being a "natural" order to things, it is probably better to say there is a "typical" or "conventionally understood" way that things are done and there is no harm in recognizing and celebrating that so long as it isn't exploited to make grandstanding political statements.
(In case you haven't noticed, I have a knee-jerk negative reaction to grandstanding political statements and presumptions of engaging in social engineering..)

Secondly, culture is every bit as "natural" to human interaction as biology is. Typically we have found it easier to modify our culture to suit our environments since culture can adapt in one generation while biology takes several hundred, but the process of creating traditional, cultural, religious, social, and legal norms is a natural part of being human. Trying to separate the two is senseless.
My point is and has always been that life doesn't become more beautiful by insisting that everyone has to conform to the same standards. Instead of telling a woman that she is free to do anything that a man can we ought to be spreading the message that she is free to be the best women she can be.

What that entails will vary depending on a girls' innate talents and the culture in which she was raised. Since the large majority of people tend to adopt roles and obligations that are similar and culturally defined, however, there is no harm in having a broadly accepted cultural and traditional standard. That doesn't mean nothing variant ever happens. It just means that's not the point of this occasion. Just like having Mother's day doesn't mean we have anything against women who choose not be be mothers. Or St. Valentine's day doesn't mean we have anything against single people.

What you don't seem to know about Karwa Chauth is that ... This is followed by lovemaking in the bedroom where wife gets to be on top!

scores of desis will be looking at their parents and co-workers in a new light today.

This is such a sweet post.

Yes, and my own impression had been that it is a light-hearted reminder that it is Raksha Bandhan day.

Ennis should have chosen the labels 'Humor' 'Humor' and 'Only humor'. And locked up Chaitan and Avani in the bunker until they figured out the way to make the labels show up more prominently.

Wow...it's really shocking to see you use the word "Indians" as a reference term for Native Americans. The term "Indians" used for Native Americans is equally offensive to both Indians, from India, and Native Americans, as it was incorrectly assumed that Native Americans were Indians. This term is extremely antiquated and offensive, and it's really disappointing to see in a blog that attempts to point out racist offenses against South Asians. How can we condemn ignorant remarks about South Asians/South Asia, when this blog is doing the same thing to Native Americans?

I find it fascinating that these types of offensive terms, including the horrid "Red Indian" term, are commonly used among South Asians, and I really implore Sepiamutiny to start using the proper, inoffensive terms to refer to other racial groups. After all, we are all fighting the same fight against colonialism, and racism in the Western world, and there's no need to alienate and offend those Native Americans that may be reading this blog as well!

Saira,
Hang on...
Most people I know who are "Native American" and who work closely with those who would be identified by that term by the US government actually prefer to be called American Indian. (It is generally agreed upon that "Red Indian" is offensive, as you point out.)
Interestingly enough, some people actually have a bigger problem with the term "Native American". Once in the mountains of Montana, I checked into a hotel where a lovely Blackfoot receptionist took down my information and announced, "You and me, we have something in common." I looked at her, probably a little confused.

"We're both Indians."-- at which point, both of us cracked up.

indian is right, and saira goes too far. i had a friend who was an 'activist' who went to some grand multicult conference, and talking to an activist of indigenous american heritage ( :-) he used the term 'native american,' and was told by this individual that most 'indians' preferred 'indian.' ok, so later he talked to *another* indigenous american activist, used the term 'american indian,' and was told it was offensive. so, it being a multiculturalist event he just avoided using any reference to the indigenous americans for the rest of the conference since it wasn't as if it people were wearing stickers on what term they preferred....

i've been at coffee shops where a bunch of kids from a local tribe were chillin', and they freely used the world 'indian.' for american indians the term indian seems to be similar to the word 'black' for african americans commonly used in interpersonal discussion but less common in academic discourse

Saira:

The Smithsonian museum on the mall is called "The Museum of the American Indian" and it's a fairly new museum. It's not an offensive term.

i had a friend who was an 'activist' who went to some grand multicult conference, and talking to an activist of indigenous american heritage ( :-) he used the term 'native american,' and was told by this individual that most 'indians' preferred 'indian.' ok, so later he talked to *another* indigenous american activist, used the term 'american indian,' and was told it was offensive. so, it being a multiculturalist event he just avoided using any reference to the indigenous americans for the rest of the conference since it wasn't as if it people were wearing stickers on what term they preferred....

This is very amusing. I wonder if they were playing a practical joke. We should send some asians equipped with a hidden camera to a modern language association conference and have the say they prefer "oriental."

The Smithsonian museum on the mall is called "The Museum of the American Indian" and it's a fairly new museum. It's not an offensive term.

well i guess its really not offensive. still, i feel the native americans are wrong. they should be offended. who are they not to be offended after all the scholarship done on orientalism? But how do i convince them to take offense? this is really problematic.

More for Saira from Wikipedia:

In the 1960s and 1970s efforts were made to change "Indian" to "Native American" or, sometimes, "Amerindian".It was not entirely successful, with the new name being as problematic as the old... Many of those involved prefer Indian or American Indian to Native Americans. Charles C. Mann noted in his 2005 book 1491: New Revelations of the Americas Before Columbus that "every native person whom I have met (I think without exception) has used 'Indian' rather than 'Native American'."Russell Means, an activist in the American Indian Movement, said in 1998, "I abhor the term Native American...I prefer the term American Indian because I know its origins."
[link]

You are correct to note that "Red Indian" is considered offensive, as is Injun. However, American Indian, Indian and Native American are all roughly acceptable. Each has detractors but the pendulum seems to be swinging away from Native American these days.

While you are free to soapbox and take umbrage, please check your facts before taking umbrage. After all, I didn't send out any rakhis this year, so I have no one to protect me :)

still, "American Indian" is certainly antiquated. Shouldn't it be "American south Asian"?

Amerikkkan Indian?

"Native Umrican" is a good compromise of sorts.

Wow...it's really shocking to see you use the word "Indians" as a reference term for Native Americans. The term "Indians" used for Native Americans is equally offensive to both Indians, from India, and Native Americans, as it was incorrectly assumed that Native Americans were Indians. This term is extremely antiquated and offensive, and it's really disappointing to see in a blog that attempts to point out racist offenses against South Asians.

I think it is racist for us to be offended by the term Indian just because Native Americans were once called that.

Institutions like the veil/hijab bring out a discourse of individual choice, cultural freedoms etc.

The relatively innocent rakhi gets deconstructed with sharp intellectual scissors.

Liberal values need protection from liberals.

"Indian" vs "Native American": racist or unPC or not, I find "Native American" to be much less ambiguous than "Indian".

Frankly though, I do get tetchy -- as an Indian born in India, why should I have to redefine my terminology just because some Genoese/Catalonian/Portuguese/Spanish guy went on a loony tunes venture 500 years back and ended up in the wrong place?

My motivation therefore is not so much about causing offense to other groups as to preclude having to take offense myself.

So why does the holiday continue?

Btw, Jyotsana, I never realised that you were a dude. You come across as a very knowledgeable person. I enjoy reading your comments.

Thanks McQuade!

It is very telling that this Ennis imbecile conflates Native Americans with India Indians like an ignorant westerner at the same time that s/he launches an ignorant western-style attack on Indian culture. I won't be reading this blog again.

Just because the term "Native Indian" is used legally and in museums to define Native Americans doesn't mean it isn't offensive. I am from Canada and I know that here, the term Indian is considered VERY offensive to First Nations people in Canada, even though the Canadian government has an official ministry called the Ministry of Indian affairs.

You may know some indigenious people who are ok with being termed Indian, but there are plenty of others who find it offensive. The reason that Indians, from India, should also find the term offensive is not because it is refering to Native Americans, but rather because the term is being misused. The Europeans couldn't tell the difference between Indians from India, and the indigenous people of North America, and hence termed that as "Indians." It is very disappointing for me to see Sepia Mutiny supporting the usage of a term that is KNOWN for being offensive.

I am from Canada and I know that here, the term Indian is considered VERY offensive to First Nations people in Canada, even though the Canadian government has an official ministry called the Ministry of Indian affairs.

For example, if someone were to bring a six-pack of Molson to my house I would never invite them over again. But I understand such a thing is commonplace in your strange and exotic country.

I agree with Saira. Just because Native Americans don't find the term offensive doesn't mean its not. If a tree falls in the forrest and no one hears it, does it mean it made no sound. Hell no. Because the Canadians heard it, or at least they know it made a sound based on a-priori knowledge. Canadians are experts on what is offensive; they're a very highly advanced civilization, as evidenced by their sophisticated language: Kannada.

Saira:

The Museum of the American Indian was a cooperative effort with various American indigenous groups. It could not have been named such without their cooperation. There have been no protests or boycotts.

I also gave you examples of activists who reject Native American and prefer to be called Indian. You can insist that the term is offensive, but right now, in the US, both terms seem to be equally acceptable, and Native American is seen as just as problematic. Things may be different in Canada, but there's no term like First Nations here that has gained widespread currency.

Manju: Bravo!

Offensive words are only offensive because of the history associated with them. Not because the syllables have some innate magic power to offend. What is offensive in one cultural context would not be in another.

this sort of moral relativism a slippery slope, yoga. if everythngs relative than there is no truth and then you have nihilism which leads to the anarchy the joker inflicted on gotham city which then descends further into socialism, or medicare, whichever comes first.

@Saira et al, did you read any of the links I posted in my earlier comment? Ennis is telling the truth when he says that most people are moving away from the term "Native American." And when he means people, he doesn't mean the white government. I work with people who work with "Native American" communities _every day_, and they're less likely to use that term than "American Indian". When I have met people from these communities and asked them about it, they say "American Indian" is not offensive to them. The National Museum of the American Indian is not a place that the white man has made to stereotype the "red Indian" but an educational center involving serious research and engagement with the communities involved.

Accusing Ennis of ignorance and racism doesn't make sense to me. He made a joke. And I gave an example where the same joke was made from the other side. There is a long history of identification with the terms "Indian" and "American Indian", a history many people aren't ready to give up in the United States. Whether or not you find it offensive to your own sensibilities is another question, and you're of course welcome to your own opinion.

But in all seriousnes, and in Saira's defense, I was frankly genuinely gobsmaked to learn American Indians don't find the term offensive. If any term smacks of orientalism and "they all look alike" racism this one is it. I've long rattled the hyper-sensitive here by waiving homemade polls, but if any term qualifies for my "vanguard intellectual" loophole, this one is it.

Accusing Ennis of ignorance and racism doesn't make sense to me. He made a joke. And I gave an example where the same joke was made from the other side.

This just proves that there are insensitive people on both sides.

The Museum of the American Indian was a cooperative effort with various American indigenous groups

The DC one has an awesome cafe. You should try the chocolate churros and the Indian Pudding they list on their menu. Simply fantastic. And here I thought they were only good at the casino thing.

The DC one has an awesome cafe. You should try the chocolate churros and the Indian Pudding they list on their menu

What?! No Jalebis. This is how they repay us?

This is how they repay us?

Worse. They give us Indian "pudding" and take credit for our kheer. There should be a name for people who give like that.

For example, if someone were to bring a six-pack of Molson to my house I would never invite them over again. But I understand such a thing is commonplace in your strange and exotic country.

i guess you heard that blue moon, the "belgian" ale enjoyed by sgt crowley at the vite house is brewed by molson. yu left ving nut you.

They give us Indian "pudding" and take credit for our kheer. There should be a name for people who give like that.

guju

They give us Indian "pudding"

and they had the gall to name it rakhi road

For example, if someone were to bring a six-pack of Molson to my house I would never invite them over again

I'm with you Yoga...anything less than a case and i also sever the realtionship

Ellora@77, well said.....

seriously? you're arguing over what to call american indians? isn't this one of those things that wikipedia can resolve in less than 10 seconds? or you could read a book...

anyway, to g back to the original topic, i am aware that ashish nandi has written a text of girindhra something bose who founded the indian psychoanalitic association and whatnot. Does anyone know of any other works or theorising on rakshabandh, indigenous psychoanalytica interpretatiohns, etc.? It would be possible but I would be skeptical if the Oedipus complex was as relevant for Bengali Hindus (and possibly all Bengalis) as the effects of Goddess worship, but I don't actually know. Which is why I inquire here from you all.

best,
dr a

Think about a 15 yr old girl tying a rakhi on her 4 yr old brother, and being told by her grandfather that this means her 4 year old brother will "protect her" now simply by virtue of being the male.

Only the insane can think that way... please... for most people it's just an excuse to be happy and have fun, some pocket money for the sister... reading too much into this is futile. Jeez...

Have you ever seen a man giving rakhis to a woman?

Kind of like saying, why is it that men are expected to propose (even in the enlightened world)? It's how it's been...

Think about a 15 yr old girl tying a rakhi on her 4 yr old brother, and being told by her grandfather that this means her 4 year old brother will "protect her" now simply by virtue of being the male.

Only the insane can think that way... please... for most people it's just an excuse to be happy and have fun, some pocket money for the sister... reading too much into this is futile. Jeez...

Well, then I must be insane because that is exactly how I have thought. And when I was 4, I couldn't articulate as well and so it was all these tantrums. Things like rakhi and all were all part of a larger understanding. Boys would go to school--the good expensive one, girls would go to the local one. There are many many examples of all this in Indian culture. You all know what they are so I won't elaborate.

@96, yer funny.

To ze best of my knowledge, Rakhi is from a time when weaponry was not as equal-opportunity in terms of gender as it is now. There were swords, the bow and arrow, a spear or two and the occasional hypnotised tiger named Steve. With the exception of that last item, all of these weapons' effectiveness depended on the strength of the arm behind them. Women will never be as strong as men, so it made sense to have men protect them.

Now that weapons are on a more level playing field, it doesn't mean that you throw your sister to the wolves and tell her to sort out her own stalkers because you have QVC returns to make. I'd say that that's how everyone becomes a me-me-me selfish jerk and the family structure goes, as AM radio sports commentators say, to hell in a hand basket. Men will always be the protectors of women, and nothing slows down a man's impure motives than another man who's not having his ****. It's part of a man's nature to protect the women he loves, and it's naive to think that because the year has changed, the nature of human beings has changed.