Oh, you thought there was going to be a Tea Party and nobody was going to invite The Hindus? Oh, The Hindus are INVITED. The thing is, this particular Hindu is booked with other, more rational and less racist political affiliations. I have to wash my hair that day, Tea Partiers. AND FOR THE REST OF MY LIFE, WHENEVER ANYONE LIKE YOU CALLS. Because guess what, I have lots of Muslim friends and they are awesome, and I am not going anywhere where they are not ALSO invited.
The short version is that Tea Party Express chairperson Mark Williams, who is a CNN commentator, made a comment in which he slammed Muslims for (get this) worshipping “the terrorists’ monkey god.”
According to the NY Daily News’ first story on the topic:
“A National Tea Party leader protesting a proposed mosque near Ground Zero set off a firestorm of anger Wednesday by saying that Muslims worship “the terrorists’ monkey god.”
Mark Williams, chairman of the Tea Party Express, blogged about the 13-story mosque and Islamic cultural center planned at Park Place and Broadway, calling it a monument to the 9/11 terrorists.
“The monument would consist of a Mosque for the worship of the terrorists’ monkey-god,” Williams, a frequent guest on CNN, wrote on his Web site.”
(The article on his website is now password-protected, and to get the password, you have to buy his book, which is not on GoogleBooks as far as I can tell. Possibly because Google’s slogan is “don’t be evil.”)
BUT IT GETS EVEN BETTER.
Williams APOLOGIZED. But not to, I don’t know, HUMANITY and especially Muslims, but to his “Hindu friends.” (Who ARE you, dudes? You Hindu Friends of Mark Williams? I imagine an extremely small club.) From his blog:
“I was wrong and that was offensive. I owe an apology to millions of Hindus who worship Lord Hanuman, an actual Monkey God.”
Oh, an ACTUAL Monkey God. You’re bending your opportunistic reality to accommodate an Actual Monkey God, as opposed to the one you concocted from the space in your brain where your education was supposed to go.
BUT IT CONTINUES!
“Moreover, Hanuman is worshiped as a symbol of perseverance, strength and devotion. He is known as a destroyer of evil and to inspire and liberate. Those are hardly the traits of whatever the Hell (literally) it is that terrorists worship and worthy of my respect and admiration not ridicule.”
NY Daily News story on his apology
A whole bunch of folks (like the Manhattan borough president and some other political types) denounced what he said… but I don’t see any Tea Partiers doing it. (Counterexamples? Comment thread away.)
Let me just say, I for one do not accept his apology, because it is offered in a spirit that is completely antithetical to the Hindu faith and the Hindu community in which I was raised, and because it demeans Islam, a religion that is important to so many of my friends and loved ones.
Also, while we’re at it, I dislike the Tea Party for associating tea, my favorite beverage, with racism and discrimination. South Asian-American folks, let’s reclaim tea and stand in solidarity against this kind of asshattery.
What a rant! Viva La Sugi! :D
Well said!
I'm guessing this is all part of a larger "strategery" by Tea Party leaders. You say something completely wrongheaded and incendiary in public to make a point to your constituents, and get every blogger in the country talking about you. A couple of days later, you come up with a retraction and a half-hearted apology, so the media will think you're a nice and reasonable person, while your constituents sing your praises for not backing down even a little bit from the original wrongheaded and incendiary statement.
Did anyone read the comments to Williams' apology post on his blog? If you didn't know before, the Hindu religion is full of sex, thanks to the Kama Sutra! ;)
http://www.marktalk.com/blog/?p=9697&cpage=1#comment-51419
and mr. williams defends his little brown brothers the world 'round...
I did see that, but I couldn't bring myself to devote any more time to reading things he had written.
Damn. Well said. The second I read that story on CNN I wondered what SM's take on it would be. I wish more people would call these asshats out.
So when I first read about his comment two possibilities entered my mind.
He is mixing up everything and consciously as well as unconsciously dissing Hindus as well. Meaning ignorance, not caring to know about differences in religions, equating it with Islam. But at the same time while he is also making fun of the idea of Hindu gods (though he doesn't realize they are Hindu gods.)
But that was like a five percent chance, in my opinion.
The other possibility which I readily believed and still believe is that he was making a racial derogatory comment towards Muslims. Monkey God-->> God of Monkeys--->>the Muslims. Similar to the slur used for Arabs and Middle Easterners, which actually end up being extended to all browns from Asia and North Africa.
Also, while we’re at it, I dislike the Tea Party for associating tea, my favorite beverage, with racism and discrimination. South Asian-American folks, let’s reclaim tea and stand in solidarity against this kind of asshattery.
Maybe we should start a Chai Party.
The one comment left on his blog in response to his "apology" is so hateful towards Hindus that it seems like it could have been written by the "South Asian" Far Left...maybe they exchange notes. In any case, I agree with the basic point of your post V.V. I hope Hindu-Americans understand how hateful this dude is for not differentiating between Muslims at large and fundamentalists and steer clear of this nut. As with the case of the BNP which refers to its one Sikh member as a "guest", in his particular utopia we too would be children of a lesser god.
There are interesting *intelligent* competent discussions that can be made about what the Tea Party means, who is in it and what this incident means as a whole.
Unfortunately, I think this is going to be an opportunity for a GOP Bash fest.
Let's see how fast this comment section is going to be closed.
NYX....I agree. As someone who has occassionally voted republican at the local/state level, that would be unfortunate. But, I have to say it is harder to stand up for the GOP day by day as the last Rockefellers are drummed out and they make cynical use of these TPM wackos. Many centrist Democrats, including myself, were terrified that Code Pink and "Move On" would lose the election for us but the GOP seems to find it worthwhile to be seen in public with their "crazy uncle"
Amardeep, I believe the liberal alternative would be referred to as the Latte Party.
French presses and organic locally produced milk for everyone!
Post 3 is succinct.
Well, let's see if the Internet Hindus descend on the Tea Baggers like the legions of Hanuman -- that would be worth the price of admission.
@hema
Your hypothesis fits with highly intelligent people who carefully control their message rather than ignorant guys who just blurt out any silly thing that comes to their mind. I'm guessing you made a typo. Let me try to think who fits in better.
There ... edited it for you. :-)
Well, let's see if the Internet Hindus descend on the Tea Baggers like the legions of Hanuman -- that would be worth the price of admission.
I was hoping they would show up after Glenn Beck's "the Ganges, a river that sounds like a disease" comment. Sadly (for me), not much happened.
Give it to Mark Bhaiyya, he's got a sense of humor
who responding to a comment from Paul re CCC and Kama Sutra,
Too much monkeying around. And have we forgotten the rich popular tradition of comedy featuring Hanuman and his tail?
What? This is weird.
I am trying to recall the support the Hindu Community got from Muslims when various communities pushed back against temple development /expansions (in Pomona for instance).
No luck ...
Still thinking ...
Still no luck ...
Still thinking ...
Ok, that's taking too much time, lemme think of the help Hindu communities got in building temples in Muslim nations...
Saudi Arabia? No luck ...
UAE? Still thinking ...
Bagladesh? Still no luck ...
Malaysia? Still thinking ...
I dunno why, but somehow I cannot work up a rage at the prospect of not being able to hear "Allah ho Akbar" when I'm downtown..
The Dems are overtaken by their "crazy uncles" (and aunts) at least in the White House - see Anita Dunn, Van Jones, Valerie Jarett, Rahm Emmanuel, Kevin Jennings (the Fist Czar) etc. In all fairness, Dunn and Jones were removed from their post.
The Uncle of all Crazy Uncles is obviously Joe Biden. As a side point, there are no centrist democrats anymore which is a damn shame but it is what it is.
Besides, I don't even know who Mark Williams is. I can see the point with Beck or Palin but Mark Williams? Who even knew who he was before this controversy? How is he influencing the White House (with Beck and Palin, I could see their power but Williams?)
I say that we ignore the nuts. They come from all different political persuasions - remember Biden's quip about 7-11 and Indians? Come election time, we simply choose the less unsavory or less ignorant candidate. Getting riled up about such stuff plays to yet another stereotype of us being thin-skinned on religious matters and keeps this nonsense in play.
One days soon, this character won't be in the news and will probably return to his old job at the local DQ.
Professor sahib are lying here - you were not 'hoping' they would show up, because you knew they would not show up :). You have already decreed that one shall take offense in such matters only if ones holy book explicitly lists that act as sinful.
DizzyDesi wrote:
DizzyDesi,
I'm sure you've heard of the incident at Maple Grove when a Hindu temple was vandalized.
An Islamic punk band called the Kominas actually held a fundraiser to rebuild it.
What the hell does this even mean?
Thanks for reminding me of that. It is a bunch of supercool Bangladeshi-Americans.
Amardeep wrote:
Amardeep,
Please read this article about the Ganges River's self-purifying properties. It has dissolved oxygen levels 25 times higher than any other river in the world.
Let me help you out. Your track record of comments here makes your bigotry amply clear. So, that's the reason.
that would be taking on an opponent who'd make them run home crying to mommy. better to take on ganesha chocolates, lakshmi burgers, and love guru posters. the vigilant devout know they are the real danger.
As for the mosque, what should be looked into is who is behind it? Where is the funding coming from? There is no big Muslim residential community in that down town area, not for something that size.
That Turkish PM said something that was disturbing: "Turkey's Islamist Prime Minister Erdogan once wrote, "The mosques are our barracks, the domes our helmets, the minarets our bayonets and the faithful our soldiers." and then the Saudi's awarded this guy their "King Faisal International Prize for Service to Islam" award. If this is money from the Saudis I would not trust this mosque. They've been funding radical Islam in many countries for years now.
Plus the guy behind this project is behind something else called the Sharia Indx Project:
"So far the project has produced a book of scholarly essays on the concept of measuring a nation’s “Islamicity”, providing a theoretical foundation for the index.
By the end of this year, it expects to release the results of an unprecedented poll, conducted with the Gallup Organisation, that asked people in 44 majority-Muslim nations how well they felt their country complied with Islamic principles.
“It will create an annual rating, a score to rate countries on how compliant they are,” said Imam Feisal....
...The pillars of Shariah are based on five – some say six sacrosanct rights and principles. Breaching any of them is considered a major sin that requires punishment." http://www.thenational.ae/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20090721/NATIONAL/707209836/1138
I get the impression this guy behind the 9-11 mosque is far right.
This story is so ridiculous on so many levels. Is it wrong that I got an all-day warm fuzzy from it?
I live and work half a block from the site and speaking to people I get the impression no one wants the center there. I really hope the residents get a say
[deleted by admin for violating comment policy]
I think a multi-cultural and multi-religious center should be built there instead. A building owned by no one religion - donated perhaps to the city. Where the religions of all those who were killed that day are presented - all given equal treatment. That is a far better way to build bridges and promote tolerance.
@ Sameer.. the mosque that was built in my home town (about 40 years ago) with the help of my dad and many other members of our community was chosen because there was a building on sale that they could afford. Before that they rented a place. A lot of the time it has nothing to do with anything except availability. I noticed your article was from the Jerusalem Post, and they aren't always known for unbiased reporting.(from wiki: the paper underwent a noticeable shift to the right in the late 1980s... including the paper's advocacy for privatization of Israeli religious institutions).. Most places of worship are built or bought based on where the greater number of the people live and whether there is property or buildings for sale.
also, does anyone know if there are other places of worship near ground zero (other than mosques).. if not a multicultural center, it would be nice if there were others in the area (but maybe they're already is?)
Read some where: 'Tea Party' took the fun out of 'Tea' & 'Party'
There are at least three churches within walking distance including the oldest Catholic Parish of Manhattan
@cio: St. Paul's
Williams is an idiot, but his point is relevant. NYC should take some pointers from the Swiss about the mosque construction.
"I was hoping they would show up after Glenn Beck's "the Ganges, a river that sounds like a disease" comment. Sadly (for me), not much happened."
Allow me explain. Glenn Beck is not Muslim. So no point making an issue out of it, is there? Very logical. Also he apologised for confusing Hindus with Muslims which (1) shows correct attitude wrt Muslims and (2) implies that he could one day be persuaded that Hindus are functionally white in the US. (Wishful thinking, but anyway...)
Dizzy Desi, Next comment like this on any thread again and your done as far as commenting on SM.
"Macaca God" or "God of Macacas" ?
I guess people haven't sketched Mohammed enough for Williams to know what he looks like.
I'm OK with a complete ban on ALL RELIGIONS from building any more "places of worship".
We got enough tax-free havens already.
Dizzy Desi, Next comment like this on any thread again and your done as far as commenting on SM.
he made a valid point - you may not necessarily agree. Surely a park would be the best outcome rather than yet another religious building.
"Your" done ? - did SM outsource internship to a bogan ?
... I wonder if this tea bag dude is trying to feed on Hindu-Muslim, communal, partition hostilities to win over Hindu South Asian support in his battle against the building of the Masjid... what a tea bag
also, who is he giving the middle finger to? and that is a pretty huge middle finger... such tea baggery...
and this is already there in the neighborhood
WTF? Ben Nelson, Blanche Lincoln, Mark Warner, Joe Lieberman, Bill Clinton the entire 50-some odd member Blue Dog caucus in the House to name just a few.
Now name some mod Repubs besides Snowe and Collins. ::cue Jeopardy theme music::
No, here's a better one. Name one moderate Repub in the House. I don't think you can.
I just commented on the "apology." The person above me accepted the apology "on behalf of all Hindus."
I informed him that I, a Hindu, will not be spoken for.
Did anyone else read the NYRB article - The Tea Party Jacobins It went a long way towards helping me understand this movement that (frankly) mystifies me. I think the general idea that it is a movement without an overall direction (though with the common idea 'don't get in my way') pushing a prodding to find its boundaries (are we just xenophobic or are we uncomfortable about the greater fluidity of the 'American' identity in the age of NAFTA and globalization) can help to explain why their leaders frequently miss and make such utterly imbecilic and disgusting statements.
Mark Warner is a blue dog? LOL, I think you are cribbing from last year. The stimulus and the tarp vote in the house along with the health care vote dispelled any doubt whether these fellows are "blue" dogs.
Joe Lieberman voted for the health care bill. Just because he is a hawk on foreign policy affairs, a position that the democrats have now abandoned, does not mean he is a blue dog.
Moderate Republicans in the Senate - Lindsay Graham and for now Scott Brown who voted in financial reform legislation. Brown only opposes the health care bill.
No one in the house that I know of but I hardly doubt our problem this year is moderate republicans.
Folks, read the Tea Party Jacobin. Its brilliance is astounding.
Silly Serf, rebelling against the protective arms of the government!
How cute that they throw the "tea party are racist" argument in there by saying that they don't like Obama cause they don't look like him.
Brilliant analysis. Should win a Pulitzer prize.
Sugi for Chai Party president!
Well, let's see if the Internet Hindus descend on the Tea Baggers like the legions of Hanuman
Unfortunately, the Internet Hindus are over at HuffPo accepting Williams's apology and offering their regret at a mosque being dedicated near the WTC site on 9/11. That's a slap in the face of America, you know.
Islam haters: Even if most Islamic countries and institutions do not offer aid to our Hindu communities in America and globally, that doesn't mean we shouldn't stand up for regular Muslims who just want to go through their lives sans marginalization for being Muslim. It's not very Hindu to turn into that which you abhor.
Sick of all the crap done in the name of religion, including building places of worship using taxpayer money. Where's the Tea Party outrage there?
Why is people being genuinely being uncomfortable with the Mosque next to the propsed WTC site a slap in the face of America, like I said there is already a mosque at Warren street which is a few blocks from there. It is still an emotional issue for a lot of people, the last company I worked at lost almost 300 people and I have colleagues that still don't come downtown. This is an avoidable issue as there are 10000 other spots this mosque can be built.
whats this about, Maitri?
I actually thought they were a one issue party - protesting tax issues. Slowly we're seeing them coming out as also xenophobes, islamophobes and worst of all anti-Hanuman. Who doesn't like monkeys? I vote to change their name from Teabag to Dbag.
And by the way, why didn't the attempted mosque bombing in Florida not make bigger headlines? I heard about it via Reddit. It looks like it had some coverage in Florida.
http://www.news4jax.com/news/23620286/detail.html
How outrageously stupid of Mark Williams. How on earth did he get into CNN? Hasn't he learned anything about "checking facts" before being politically incorrect, apart from being outrageously stupid?
He must have an imaginary army of Hindu friends.
Manju: It's just that while I find myself defending the scores of law-abiding Muslims who have to deal with all this bs, it makes me sick to have to do it. Religion is such a personal thing; it's so uncouth how much of it is dragged into politics and shoved in people's faces. Spring cleaning starts at home, yadda yadda.
white people don't like getting poorer...oh well:)
In the (even recent) past Christian-Indian-American organizations such as FIACONA and Muslim-Indian-American organizations have been AWOL when hate mongering sleaze artists like Frankiln Graham or Ravi Zacharia (Living Water Ministries) have dumped on Hindus/Buddhists and their traditions. However this has nothing to do with what individuals among these communities think or feel. I will never mistake the actions of organizations for the opinions of the latter.
Mark Bhaiyya, could you try to make your points without insulting or demeaning those you disagree with?
yeah lets start the GLOBAL chai party, with jelabi and ghatiya, and other necessary treats. suger wali rotli, or some chevro, mmm. could name it nastho party?
@DizzyDesi:
Dammit. You're on to me. ;)
@ my comment in 47...
surprise, surprise. my comment wasn't approved by the site. I swear I did not use impolite/inflammatory language.
@ anony.. i just read this disclaimer on their website:
(DISCLAIMER: Please be advised that we are by no means affiliated with any other organization trying to build anything new in the area of downtown Manhattan.
Since 1970, Masjid Manhattan has been a peaceful, not-for-profit organization located in the area of downtown Manhattan. Our members are City, State and Federal employees, as well as professional employees of the Financial area who come to our Masjid to perform their daily prayers.
Masjid Manhattan and its members condemn any type of terrorist acts. In particular, the attacks of 9/11 where non-Muslims as well as Muslims lost their lives. Islam always invites for peace; therefore Islam is not responsible for the actions of some ill individuals who, independently from what Islam advocates, have hatred against humanity. As Muslims and as Americans, we will never forget the beloved ones who perished that terrible day of September 11, 2001.)
It's interesting how they have to distance themselves from people who are doing something obviously psychotic and something that is a sin in their religion (killing innocent people, committing suicide)...if a quarter of the world's population is muslim, does every one of those people have to make a statement when people they don't know do something awful because they do it in the name of their religion (when the terrorists aren't practicing the religion)?
really? a $100M mosque 2 blocks from ground zero? Is that the most p.c. way to be peaceful and open a dialogue? I'm for someone's suggestion of starting a center of multifaith dialogue and cultural expression. Imagine, rather than a mosque hosting prayers, if there was a Muslim-led center that hosted islamic art shows, sufi dancers, kathak dances, chinese calligraphy, it would do a world of good in "building understanding". What baffles me is that the Corboda House Project headed by Imam Feisal Abdul Rauf says its mission is as follows:
Cordoba Initiative aims to achieve a tipping point in Muslim-West relations within the next decade, bringing back the atmosphere of interfaith tolerance and respect that we have longed for since Muslims, Christians and Jews lived together in harmony and prosperity eight hundred years ago.
Commendable. But how will this mission be achieved by building a grand mosque near the ground-zero site?
I hate this guy Mark Williams. If it werent for racist bigoted idiots like him, people could have looked at the underlying issue of whether building a mosque there is the right thing in a more objective manner.
It's time to start facing a well know truth in Britain...Americans are naturally stupid....
@ SM Intern 40:
Apart from bad grammer ("your" done) you also seem to have no regard for freedom of speech and somebody voicing their opinion. Its evident that majority of New Yorkers living and working downtown wouldn't want an Islamic center after 9/11 and the recent bomb scare, also related to Islamic extremists. Why a simple comment like "not wanting to hear Allah uAkbar when downtown" deserve such intolerance from the blog-managers is beyond me.
Ummm.. it's spelt grammAr.
Unless you believe that Islam and extremists are indistinguishable or at least synonymous, well, yeah, it is a bigoted idea. I guess freedom, property rights, right to contract and all that are good for everybody... except Muslims.
Asshattery indeed!
Also, I agree with this post: "Why is people being genuinely being uncomfortable with the Mosque next to the propsed WTC site a slap in the face of America, like I said there is already a mosque at Warren street which is a few blocks from there. It is still an emotional issue for a lot of people, the last company I worked at lost almost 300 people and I have colleagues that still don't come downtown. This is an avoidable issue as there are 10000 other spots this mosque can be built."
I think it is a completely insensitive to build one near or on ground zero. I wonder how those who suggested the idea missed the huge "DUH" in the picture. Of course something like this would cause controversy and provoke idiots like Mark Williams. This would do nothing to facilitate or bridge relations between east/west cultures and religions. An inter-faith or multicultural center would be a better alternative.
Dizzy Desi: I am trying to recall the support the Hindu Community got from Muslims when various communities pushed back against temple development /expansions (in Pomona for instance).
TTCUSM: I'm sure you've heard of the incident at Maple Grove when a Hindu temple was vandalized.
An Islamic punk band called the Kominas actually held a fundraiser to rebuild it.
The Kominas are NOT an "Islamic band". If you read their interviews, none of them are practicing Muslims and at least one of them is openly ATHEIST.
It would be revolutionary to see PRACTICING Muslims do something like what they did - fundraising for a Hindu Temple. However, I wouldn't expect it because iconography is HARAM in Islam.
Building a $100 million mosque near Ground Zero makes about as much sense as opening an Enola Gay exhibit in Hiroshima or Nagasaki.
I'm surprised the Bahais or Scientologists haven't proposed a center of their's be built there.